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Evolutionary Need For Faith?
Posted: 06 February 2006 10:28 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 16 ]  
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Homunculus   Yes, exactly.  So if we are not attached to the word, the idea, the concept, the form, to anything that ‘appears’ in the mind, anything that the mind has invented, or remembers from an experience, then what is there?

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Posted: 07 February 2006 12:52 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 17 ]  
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[quote author=“jonnydor”]Homunculus   Yes, exactly.  So if we are not attached to the word, the idea, the concept, the form, to anything that ‘appears’ in the mind, anything that the mind has invented, or remembers from an experience, then what is there?

Illusion is all there is, Jonnydor. But an admitted illusion for me has been a vast improvement over my former attempt at objective Truth.

We have bone, muscle, nerve, etc. We can adhere to the power of our nervous system. This fact gives me great comfort, and although my religious past still lurks around in my head at times, my divorce from Jesus of Nazareth has been nothing short of miraculous as far as lasting peace of mind.

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Philosophy may in no way interfere with the actual use of language; it can in the end only describe it. For it cannot give it any foundations either. It leaves everything as it is.
Ludwig Wittgenstein

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Posted: 07 February 2006 10:41 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 18 ]  
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:D

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Posted: 07 February 2006 11:40 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 19 ]  
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Ditto, friend. We should have coffee together sometime.

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Philosophy may in no way interfere with the actual use of language; it can in the end only describe it. For it cannot give it any foundations either. It leaves everything as it is.
Ludwig Wittgenstein

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Posted: 07 February 2006 08:34 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 20 ]  
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Homunculus   Thank you.

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Posted: 08 February 2006 08:33 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 21 ]  
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The problem has been discussed at large already and I would like to throw in what I know about it.

1. Somebody formulated what kind of evolutionary advantages (on the group level, not on individual level) the religious faith might provide. I watched a TV program, which was OK in terms of providing some sort of convincing arguments.

2. It is also postulated that origins of every religious belief include some genuine “mystic” experience. Whether this experience is something pathological and/or whether it is linked to the evolutionary advantage it might provide is a separate question.

3. It doesn’t take a genius to realize that once a religious faith is born it is widely used (without any mystic experience) to manipulate people and societies.

4. The exploration of the nature of mystic experience is in itself very interesting topic, at least to me.

T.O.

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Posted: 13 March 2006 07:45 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 22 ]  
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I added this thread yesterday to the Other Reading section, but after stumbling across this, I thought I’d shamelessly link to it here - should add some insight.

 

I particularly recommend his book “How the Mind Works” to the 2 major protagonists of this thread (Homonculus and Jonnydor), as this work discusses every one of your points and ideas*, elaborates, and if it suckers you in like it did me, will change those ideas completely!


*:  Including your namesake HC…  wink

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Posted: 14 March 2006 01:03 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 23 ]  
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Sjkebab hi,    interesting link. 
Do you want to understand how your mind works, actually, and therefore Mind in general or do you want an explanation, scientific or otherwise about how it works? 
Belief, faith, conviction, certainty,opinion, assumption can be explained but there will be disagreement all along the way wont there? We look for explanations, rational or otherwise for everything we don’t understand.  But do we settle for knowledge about…... rather than understanding of….....?
As you are reading this are you aware of what is happening in you to what is being written here - is there a feeling of agreement or disagreement, like or dislike or other?  smile
If the human being thinks he/she is a separate entity, an individual, a unique personality then is that actually true? If the person thinks it is then that automatically brings an ‘afterlife’ in to play.  ‘what’s going to happen to me and my loved ones when we all die?’ ‘I’m lonely so I need someone to be there for me’ and on and on. Right, no?
One primary point that was overlooked in that article was the matter of Fear.  Fear of snakes yes, but Fear in general in the mind, fear that causes one to ‘pray’, to want someone, a ‘higher power’, to look after us.  Fear of not surviving is natuaral say but the mind wants to survive in terms of a personal ‘me’?
Now Sjkebab, the main thing is, what is happening in you? Understanding that is more real than anything I say or anyone else says, right?  :D

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Posted: 15 March 2006 08:38 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 24 ]  
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Can’t believe my idiocy….
I had a big long detailed reply to ya, and then promptly turned my computer off before sending it.  Doh!
I’ll try again - bare with me… raspberry

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