Sam Harris

British author and outspoken atheist Christopher Hitchens volunteers to experience waterboarding, a technique agents use to get information out of terrorist suspects. The method is controversial because Bush and other high-ranking officials in the U.S. government insist waterboarding isn’t torture.  “We don’t torture” Bush has said.

Well, Hitchens proves otherwise by his own experience. What’s interesting about this is that Hitchens has also been an apologist for Bush’s foreign policy, including the invasion of Iraq.

Believe me, it’s torture

rab - 03 July 2008 04:07 PM

British author and outspoken atheist Christopher Hitchens volunteers to experience waterboarding, a technique agents use to get information out of terrorist suspects. The method is controversial because Bush and other high-ranking officials in the U.S. government insist waterboarding isn’t torture.  “We don’t torture” Bush has said.

Well, Hitchens proves otherwise by his own experience. What’s interesting about this is that Hitchens has also been an apologist for Bush’s foreign policy, including the invasion of Iraq.

Believe me, it’s torture

Sure, waterboarding is torture , but there are differant degrees of torture. Some torture, especially that were used in the past, is beyond imagination it is so painful- like the torture racks and crucification of the old days. Waterboarding , while it may be physically painful to some extent, is mostly the pain of fright it seems to me. A person knows he/she is not going to die, for one thing and probably knows it won’t be something that is lengthy .WE could say the same things about the “torture’of leading naked captive Muslims around on a lease. That would be the pain of humiliation.
I think, for the most part barbaric torture is practiced seldom today, with the exception of radical ( and sometimes “moderate”)Mulsims . I’ve read enough about it and otherwise learned about it for a long time now. They set people on fire and burn them alive; they chop off arms and legs ( and sometime other places ); they shamelessly behead enemies and send their trophies to the enemy’s friends. Such things are not rare amost those people , but common.

I’m not saying Bush is right to allow waterboarding , but where is the outrage against the more extreme types of torture ? To know it still exsists in this day and age on this earth makes me want to vomit.

Dee - 06 July 2008 08:48 AM

 

I’m not saying Bush is right to allow waterboarding , but where is the outrage against the more extreme types of torture ? To know it still exsists in this day and age on this earth makes me want to vomit.

The outrage is found by separating the barbarians from the civilized.

Barbarians use torture (including water boarding).
The civilized don’t.

The Spanish Inquisitioners first used it and…....of course they used it for torture. The Bushcovites are liars, frauds and evil idiots and a disgrace to America.

If George W Bush were born in the Saudi Arabian Desert instead of christian Texas, he would be hiding in a cave with OBL and plotting to announce the next ‘fatwa’ for Allah.

Zealots are…..all the same in mind. The zealot see’s torture as his crusade for righteousness.

But of course, and thankfully, most of you already understand this.

lindajean - 06 July 2008 06:32 PM

Dee - 06 July 2008 08:48 AM

 

I’m not saying Bush is right to allow waterboarding , but where is the outrage against the more extreme types of torture ? To know it still exsists in this day and age on this earth makes me want to vomit.

The outrage is found by separating the barbarians from the civilized.

Barbarians use torture (including water boarding).
The civilized don’t.

Compare waterboarding to stoning a woman to death. ( Something some Muslim societies still do .) Both are torture, but which is more Barbaric ?  We have heard a lot of sound and fury about waterboarding for years now.  Why is it so hard for we in the civilized world to speak out and make a stink about the cruel and inhumane treatment of women ( and men ) by societies who claim to be “beautiful and peaceful “, and publicly point the finger at those who are guilty of these atrocities ?  Are we afraid of a backlash ? Then admit it—we have become afraid ! Or do we “see no evil ” because of great sweetheart deals with oil monarchs ?  Either way, hypocracy has become a way of life .

If we want and expect other nations and groups to live by the Geneva Convention, and to treat our war time combatants respectfully then we should not waterboard or torture theirs.

Take the high ground when you are right and just and set an example for all to follow.

This really is a very simple issue.

Torture does not work anyway.

Dee

Why is it so hard for we in the civilized world to speak out and make a stink about the cruel and inhumane treatment of women ( and men ) by societies who claim to be “beautiful and peaceful “, and publicly point the finger at those who are guilty of these atrocities ?

We cannot publicly point the finger at others’ barbarism when we are breaking the Geneva Convention rules and are acting like barbarians ourselves.  To do so would be hypocritical.  We have to pull out the beam in our own eye before we condemn the beam in the eyes of others.

lindajean - 07 July 2008 03:58 PM

Dee

Why is it so hard for we in the civilized world to speak out and make a stink about the cruel and inhumane treatment of women ( and men ) by societies who claim to be “beautiful and peaceful “, and publicly point the finger at those who are guilty of these atrocities ?

We cannot publicly point the finger at others’ barbarism when we are breaking the Geneva Convention rules and are acting like barbarians ourselves.  To do so would be hypocritical.  We have to pull out the beam in our own eye before we condemn the beam in the eyes of others.

I agree with all of you that waterboarding is torture, and unacceptable. Any kind of torture is horrible and shameful. I still can’t believe we, the USA, can openly admit that we have used such a thing, and not feel abashed and rotten. Totally humilliated in the eyes of the rest of the world.  Torture is lowly and the USA should apologize and never do that kind of thing again.  But I still say Militant ( and some not militant ) Islamists are more grossly engaged , and comfortable with torture than other groups etc. As a matter of fact it is common with them and they take it casually; even bragg about it . For example: when they encounter and capture non-Muslim troups they can’t just take them hostage and wait for the next movement etc. or shoot them, they have to torture them. It’s thier way. Tortured dead bodies are found often laying in the gutters and streets .  If anyone thinks we are horrible for waterboarding, remember that we are not like certain other people when it comes to abuse—and we never will be .

Dee
I agree with all of you that waterboarding is torture, and unacceptable. Any kind of torture is horrible and shameful. I still can’t believe we, the USA, can openly admit that we have used such a thing, and not feel abashed and rotten. Totally humilliated in the eyes of the rest of the world.  Torture is lowly and the USA should apologize and never do that kind of thing again.

Now you are starting to get on the right track. Go girl!

But I still say Militant ( and some not militant ) Islamists are more grossly engaged , and comfortable with torture than other groups etc. As a matter of fact it is common with them and they take it casually; even bragg about it . For example: when they encounter and capture non-Muslim troups they can’t just take them hostage and wait for the next movement etc. or shoot them, they have to torture them. It’s thier way. Tortured dead bodies are found often laying in the gutters and streets .

Like I said, barbarism.
I don’t think anyone here has refuted that. But you continue to bring it up.

If anyone thinks we are horrible for waterboarding, remember that we are not like certain other people when it comes to abuse—and we never will be .

We NEVER will be? Our history proves otherwise (slavery, genocide, etc…)

Never say never.