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Objective and verifiable proof of the divine origin of Quran
 Posted: 30 March 2009 06:43 PM [ Ignore ]   [ # 16 ]
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Ha! Aaron-I did not notice that they were dogs either until after I first posted and I went back and looked and noticed they we dogs and not cats so I edited my post! LOL

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‘Every reflecting mind must acknowledge that there is no proof of the existence of a Deity’

‘If ignorance of nature gave birth to gods, knowledge of nature destroys them’

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 Posted: 04 April 2009 07:23 AM [ Ignore ]   [ # 17 ]
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GAD - 30 March 2009 11:48 AM

Your being generous by calling it mathematics….... What are the statics of odd and even e.g. heads and tails, equal. 114 = 57 odd and 57 even, what are the odds, pretty fucking good!!

You don’t seem to know much about Statistics (not statics)
The first fact has the probability of 3 to 4 percent. Which means if you get 100 books from the library, 3 or 4 will have that. It is the second fact that has extremely low probability. Write a computer program or get some one to write it for you or I can send it to you. Generate 114 random numbers each indicating the number of verses in a chapter and assign them to an array of 114 integers. Then see if make fact 2 and 3 happen. Repeat the process in a loop millions of time. I did it but till yet have not got such a set of random numbers.
I haven’t even tried the other facts

Here is one reply I found on the web:

The reply says nothing about the Qur’anic miracle directly. All it does is confuse the issue by bringing an alleged Bible miracle giving the impression they’re all the same. The bible miracle is just based on one number pulled from the bible that has some interesting qualities relating to trinity. This could also happen by chance or some human author could have easily put it there. However the Qur’anic miracle is totally different it encompasses the whole of Quran. Number of verses in every chapter of the Quran and its position in the Quran bring about the total. If any changes are made either by adding/removing verses or changing the order of the Sura’s the pattern will be destroyed.

This is not the only numerical miracle but this is the most easy to verify and check.

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 Posted: 04 April 2009 08:47 AM [ Ignore ]   [ # 18 ]
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Again, numerology is confirmation bias. It is wishful thinking. It is finding what you want to find.

Again, there are between 7-14 versions of the Koran. Scholars still dispute exactly how many. They have between 6200 and 6240 verses. Not all even have 6236.

Here is a link with more Koran numerology that predicted the end of the United States in 2007. Well, we are still here. Lots of fancy numerals here, but all for naught. Once you understand the delusion of numerology you will feel quite silly about all of this. Afterall would the God that created the universe really only reveal himself to us through the occult of hidden numbers? Preposterous and childish. Enjoy the link

http://yoel.info/2007numerology.htm

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‘Every reflecting mind must acknowledge that there is no proof of the existence of a Deity’

‘If ignorance of nature gave birth to gods, knowledge of nature destroys them’

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 Posted: 04 April 2009 10:15 AM [ Ignore ]   [ # 19 ]
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McCreason - 04 April 2009 12:47 PM

Again, numerology is confirmation bias. It is wishful thinking. It is finding what you want to find.

I’m not finding any hidden meaning of numbers in the Quran other than the obvious fact that it couldn’t have occurred by chance. The number of verses in Sura’s and the order of the Sura’s all adhere to the intricate mathematical patterns that

1. Could not have occurred by chance
2. Could not have been produced by humans

The above are the only two conclusions derived. No dooms day prophecies, 666, this means that and that means this etc

Again, there are between 7-14 versions of the Koran. Scholars still dispute exactly how many. They have between 6200 and 6240 verses. Not all even have 6236.

There is one and only one version of the Qur’an that the Muslims have. Non Muslim/Anti Muslim ‘scholars’ may have several versions of Quran to fool people like you. But Muslims have been memorizing the complete Quran from day one.
Every year in the month of Ramadan the complete Qur’an is recited in hundered of thousands of Mosques around the world. We do quarrel unfortunately over trivial issues in religion and separate our Mosques but this is one of those things over which there is no dispute. And now this grand discovery has proved that what we have is authentic!

Here is a link with more Koran numerology that predicted the end of the United States in 2007. Well, we are still here. Lots of fancy numerals here, but all for naught. Once you understand the delusion of numerology you will feel quite silly about all of this. Afterall would the God that created the universe really only reveal himself to us through the occult of hidden numbers? Preposterous and childish. Enjoy the link

http://yoel.info/2007numerology.htm

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 Posted: 04 April 2009 10:33 AM [ Ignore ]   [ # 20 ]
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‘There is one and only one version of the Qur’an that the Muslims have. Non Muslim/Anti Muslim ‘scholars’ may have several versions of Quran to fool people like you. But Muslims have been memorizing the complete Quran from day one.’

http://www.wikiislam.com/wiki/The_Origins_of_the_Quran

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‘Every reflecting mind must acknowledge that there is no proof of the existence of a Deity’

‘If ignorance of nature gave birth to gods, knowledge of nature destroys them’

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 Posted: 04 April 2009 10:38 AM [ Ignore ]   [ # 21 ]
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A hidden numerical pattern (numerology) does not make anything authentic. It does not make eveything in the Koran true. Anybody who wants to spend the time deciphering numerical patterns can do so, in any book, and will find them. It has nothing to do with the truthfullness or authenticity of what is written in any book.

ZB, you are not thinking here, and being duped.

You want to believe, so you have made a leap of faith to do so.

It’s greater context is known as delusion.

It appears that no matter what anybody says here, your mind is made up. That is called absolutism, and you are drowning in it.

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‘Every reflecting mind must acknowledge that there is no proof of the existence of a Deity’

‘If ignorance of nature gave birth to gods, knowledge of nature destroys them’

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 Posted: 04 April 2009 10:56 AM [ Ignore ]   [ # 22 ]
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Zit Boy - 04 April 2009 02:15 PM

I’m not finding any hidden meaning of numbers in the Quran other than the obvious fact that it couldn’t have occurred by chance. The number of verses in Sura’s and the order of the Sura’s all adhere to the intricate mathematical patterns that

1. Could not have occurred by chance
2. Could not have been produced by humans

The above are the only two conclusions derived. No dooms day prophecies, 666, this means that and that means this etc

... and it’s all utterly vapid bullshit ... yeah, we’ve got it.

Ever heard of the Moby Dick Code? Check it out. Test what it is you think you believe rather than just convincing yourself. The former leads to understanding, the latter to dogmatism and division. The former is honest, the latter self-deception.

Learn to derive your understanding of reality from reality rather than imposing your personal sentiments upon it, and to accept your limitations.

In other words, grow up. Learn to think like an adult.

Byron

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“We say, ‘Love your brother…’ We don’t say it really, but… Well we don’t literally say it. We don’t really, literally mean it. No, we don’t believe it either, but… But that message should be clear.”—David St. Hubbins

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 Posted: 04 April 2009 11:18 AM [ Ignore ]   [ # 23 ]
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Zit Boy - 04 April 2009 11:23 AM

You don’t seem to know much about Statistics (not statics)
The first fact has the probability of 3 to 4 percent. Which means if you get 100 books from the library, 3 or 4 will have that.

Actually the probability is 7.5% and it is the single highest probability there is. What that means is that if I went to a library that had 100,000 books and I randomly picked 114 of them the odds that 57 were even and 57 were odd is 7.5%. If all 114 were either even or odd the probability is so astronomical that it is called the library miracle, and it puts your miracle to shame.

[ Edited: 04 April 2009 11:20 AM by GAD]
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Why is there Something instead of Nothing: No reason or ever knowable reason.

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 Posted: 04 April 2009 06:59 PM [ Ignore ]   [ # 24 ]
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McCreason - 04 April 2009 02:33 PM

‘There is one and only one version of the Qur’an that the Muslims have. Non Muslim/Anti Muslim ‘scholars’ may have several versions of Quran to fool people like you. But Muslims have been memorizing the complete Quran from day one.’

http://www.wikiislam.com/wiki/The_Origins_of_the_Quran

So now anti Islamic bigots will decide what we believe ??

http://www.islamic-awareness.org/Quran/Text/

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 Posted: 05 April 2009 04:20 AM [ Ignore ]   [ # 25 ]
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GAD - 04 April 2009 03:18 PM
Zit Boy - 04 April 2009 11:23 AM

You don’t seem to know much about Statistics (not statics)
The first fact has the probability of 3 to 4 percent. Which means if you get 100 books from the library, 3 or 4 will have that.

Actually the probability is 7.5% and it is the single highest probability there is. What that means is that if I went to a library that had 100,000 books and I randomly picked 114 of them the odds that 57 were even and 57 were odd is 7.5%.

And that’s only for the first fact infidel boy. Try to calculate the prob. of the next two facts. And add to that the other facts and the probability IS ASTRONOMICAL.

If all 114 were either even or odd the probability is so astronomical that it is called the library miracle, and it puts your miracle to shame.

Except that it never happened.

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 Posted: 05 April 2009 05:06 AM [ Ignore ]   [ # 26 ]
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Dream on, stupid filth.

You do not have the human worth warranting any other type of response.

[ Edited: 05 April 2009 05:13 AM by arildno]
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 Posted: 05 April 2009 08:16 AM [ Ignore ]   [ # 27 ]
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‘So now anti Islamic bigots will decide what we believe ??’

Irony. No Islamic bigotry is telling YOU what to believe.

Have you even read any of the Koran’s?

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‘Every reflecting mind must acknowledge that there is no proof of the existence of a Deity’

‘If ignorance of nature gave birth to gods, knowledge of nature destroys them’

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 Posted: 05 April 2009 08:35 AM [ Ignore ]   [ # 28 ]
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It has become apparent to me that deluded, deranged and dangerous people that think like Zit Boy are the exact reason that Sam Harris believes we should not rule out a pre-emptive nuclear strike against fundamental Islamists.

Perhaps destroying part of our civilization would be better than letting superstitious lunaticts destroy all of it.

Thanks for showing up here ZB, you have proven our point precisely.

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‘Every reflecting mind must acknowledge that there is no proof of the existence of a Deity’

‘If ignorance of nature gave birth to gods, knowledge of nature destroys them’

Percy Bysshe Shelley

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 Posted: 05 April 2009 09:20 AM [ Ignore ]   [ # 29 ]
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Zit Boy - 04 April 2009 10:59 PM

So now anti Islamic bigots will decide what we believe ??

Jesus H. Fucking Christ ... dude, get your panties straightened out and relax. Pretty much everyone in here respects all faith-based religions equally.

It’s about the bullshit, not any particular Grand Poobah or silly hat fetishes.

And the very idea of someone else deciding what you or anyone else believes is absurd. Some people are more easily influenced, to be sure, but to suggest that someone who you disagree with is somehow deciding what you believe makes even less sense than complaining that someone else pissed your pants.

We don’t buy your religious nonsense. It’s nothing personal (we don’t buy anyone else’s either). No one here has the first clue as to whether you’re good company or a raging asshole. Some may have started forming that opinion, but it’s solely based upon this extremely limited medium of communication, and further restricted to this particular topic, so even if all of us were to think you’re a seriously religiostupidified fuckwad it doesn’t mean much in terms of who you are outside of this extremely narrow context ... unless you’re hard core solely all about the religiostupidification I suppose, and there just isn’t much more to you. I doubt that’s the case though—or I guess it’s more accurate to say there’s plenty of room for doubt, and I personally tend to offer that benefit, fairly generously.

Bottom line, a negative assessment of a given set of doctrine most certainly doesn’t equate to bigotry, and you don’t think so either, in spite of your emotional reaction.

Byron

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“We say, ‘Love your brother…’ We don’t say it really, but… Well we don’t literally say it. We don’t really, literally mean it. No, we don’t believe it either, but… But that message should be clear.”—David St. Hubbins

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 Posted: 05 April 2009 07:01 PM [ Ignore ]   [ # 30 ]
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McCreason - 05 April 2009 12:35 PM

It has become apparent to me that deluded, deranged and dangerous people that think like Zit Boy are the exact reason that Sam Harris believes we should not rule out a pre-emptive nuclear strike against fundamental Islamists.

Perhaps destroying part of our civilization would be better than letting superstitious lunaticts destroy all of it.

Thanks for showing up here ZB, you have proven our point precisely.

In other words, you should be prepared to kill all those who disagree with you. Another Stalin, Lenin or Mao in the making?

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