Sam's spreading his "faith" to the UK
Posted: 19 March 2005 02:30 AM   [ Ignore ]  
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Sam is spreading his attack on religion in the UK. Wonderful…

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,1072-1531851,00.html

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Posted: 19 March 2005 02:42 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 1 ]  
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Ok Mr. PHD, let’s go…

You said: “But by failing to live by the letter of the texts — while tolerating the irrationality of those who do — religious moderates betray faith and reason equally.”

Sam, I said it before, I’ll say it again, Christians are set free from the law. We don’t have to live by the letter of the law. We have liberty in Christ. You are either a Christian, which is a good thing for society (probably the best that society has to offer), or you are not.

Sam…sam. You said: “All we can say, as religious moderates, is that we don’t like the personal and social costs that a full embrace of scripture imposes on us.”

Sam, as a Christain, the more you give a full embrace of the scripture, the more you get set free. Personal and social costs come with a joyfull heart. What you said may be true for other religions, but not for Christianity.

You said: “We can no longer ignore the fact that billions of our neighbors believe in the metaphysics of martyrdom, or in the literal truth of the book of Revelation “

Sam…sam, how many people you know were killed because someone believes the literal truth of the book of Revelation? I totally reject your way of lumping Christianity in with any context of violence.

By the way, I believe in the literal truth of the book of Revelation. Therefore, I will continue to pray for lost souls like yourself. (where is the violence in that?)

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Posted: 13 April 2005 10:43 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 2 ]  
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Of course you have to follow the law. The USA is a nation of law, the main law being the Constitution of the United Sates of America, and with the top arbiter of what is constitutional and what isnt, is the Supreme Court.

Unless you believe the country should be a theocracy? A kind of religious anarchy?

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Posted: 13 April 2005 01:10 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 3 ]  
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[quote author=“Dragon”]Of course you have to follow the law. The USA is a nation of law, the main law being the Constitution of the United Sates of America, and with the top arbiter of what is constitutional and what isnt, is the Supreme Court.

Unless you believe the country should be a theocracy? A kind of religious anarchy?

The first time I read TC’s post, I assumed he was referring to old testament law, but on the second reading, I came to the same conclusion you did.

Well, he’s right about one thing. None of us has to live by the letter of the law. However, we still have to pay the consequences when we choose to ignore the law (and get caught). Nothing special about christians in that respect. Which I think is the point you are making.

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Posted: 13 April 2005 01:19 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 4 ]  
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Whether you believe in the book of revelations as literal truth or not, the only sane conclusion to arrive at is that it is something to be avoided at all costs. Anyone looking forward to those events or even worse, anyone working towards bringing them about, belongs in a straight jacket. It would be putting it mildly to say they are NOT “a good thing for society”, much less “the best that society has to offer”.

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Posted: 13 April 2005 09:31 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 5 ]  
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Well, we finally have Champ revealing the true danger of Christianity.

1. They are “above the law” the rest of us have to follow, no matter what nutcase version of Christianity they follow, even if they are White Separatists or Racists.

2. They therefore are “better” than other people, being above the law makes you feel “superior”.  Since they are now “superior” no matter how Stupid they are, of course they get the power to decide things for other people.

So, the next logical step once they take over the government, is in-fighting between different Christian sects over doctrine and dogma, while they make “laws” for US to follow, that of course, they dont have too.

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Posted: 14 April 2005 02:23 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 6 ]  
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” So, the next logical step once they take over the government, is infighting between different Christian sects over doctrine and dogma, while they make “laws” for US to follow, that of course, they dont have too.”

Yes, I know the quote didn’t apply to the Book of Revelations, but it might as well have. I sat up last night really late watching part of “The House of David” on PBS; the part about the “end of days” and the fall of Judea. it’s surprisingly good and surprisingly timely. Not a religious show at all, it’s based on the actual writings of contemporary historians. One thing it manages to do well is put Jesus into the historical context of his time as just another messiah and leader of one of many Jewish sects. By then, of course, the Romans had conquered the country. The response was to splinter more than they already had into various sects, which fell into two groups, those who felt they should fight the Romans to the death, and those who felt this was futile. While trying to decide how to respond to Roman occupation, they, of course, fought each other in a bloody civil war. The strongest feeling was that this was the “end of days.” Jesus taught that it was the “end of days.”

For them, it was. That’s why I quoted that particular passage. These different sects did, in fact, do their best to destroy each other in civil war, finally put down by the Romans who then forced them into exile, fighting over “doctrine and dogma” each sect convinced it had the one and only truth direct from God’s mouth, thus bringing about what was, for them, definitely the “end of days.” This prophesy functioned as a perfect self-fulfilling prophesy. That’s what scares me about the Book of Revelations. We have in our hands all the weapons needed to at least destroy civilization by once again using the notion of an “end of days” as a self-fulfilling prophesy. I don’t know why there’s such a self-destructive, murder/suicide psychological motif hidden in religion, but there is, and we’re in serious danger of history repeating itself. If it does, it’s certainly not going to be because of the will of any kind of god, any more than it was then.

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Posted: 14 April 2005 04:34 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 7 ]  
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[quote author=“MJ”]I don’t know why there’s such a self-destructive, murder/suicide psychological motif hidden in religion, but there is, and we’re in serious danger of history repeating itself.

The motif is not in religion, it is in human nature.  Religion is just a very convenient mechanism for unleashing it.  It provides a ratonal for doing the nasty things people want to do. 

When positive attributes of human nature are prevalent religion can be a rational for doing good works.  But all too often, the negative attributes show themselves due to in-group/out-group stresses.

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Posted: 14 April 2005 06:11 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 8 ]  
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I think you can find a key to this in another thread….

It’s drama, its romance, its magic, its every man as the hero in his own universe, the chosen one, the guy with the ring !!

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