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Evolution…..EXPOSED!
Posted: 05 April 2005 07:55 AM   [ Ignore ]  
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Wow, now that is some interesting stuff! "With evolution, facts follow theories…."

From one of your own, only this one comes from the right side of the aisle.

http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=43456

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Posted: 05 April 2005 08:29 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 1 ]  
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Ridiculous. The article isn’t backed by a single fact, only by one guy’s opinion.

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Posted: 05 April 2005 08:32 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 2 ]  
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How can you just disregard this article???!!!

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Posted: 05 April 2005 08:32 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 3 ]  
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This columnist seems to argue that one species not changing is a valid argument against evolution, but then wouldnt the oppsoite also be true?  Would the millions of species that have changed be an argument for evolution?

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Posted: 05 April 2005 09:22 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 4 ]  
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[quote author=“TheChampion”]Wow, now that is some interesting stuff! “With evolution, facts follow theories….”

From one of your own, only this one comes from the right side of the aisle.

http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=43456

***
Let’s devise a test.  We will examine the food chain to find a spot where a given organism (for want of a better term) is eaten/consumed by ONLY one other organism.  We will eradicate this organism.  If evolution doesn’t allow any adaptions above and below this spot on the food chain, then your god MUST step in to fix earth.  If he/she doesn’t, that will disprove god.

JL

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Posted: 05 April 2005 10:04 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 5 ]  
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The horseshoe crab is one of hundreds of organisms that have been virtually unchanged for millions of years.  This fellow writes for ICR and christianasnwers too, should I believe the crap he prints there?  You will never learn anything, Champ, or be taken seriously by anyont with a brain until you look behind the things printed that you agree with.

If you are ever interested, send me a private message, and I will send you some links, and show you some things that will blow your mind.  Naw, forget it!  You would just read 17 pages and find 25 things that conflict with the stupid bible, and give up.  Can’t you see how that stupid book conflicts with itself?  Or do they teach you to ignore that in the christian school you went to?

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Posted: 05 April 2005 10:06 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 6 ]  
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We’re rather harsh today. Having a bad day?

Send me the links. I’ll try to keep an open mind. But if they attempt to twist history and throw a little lie in every truth, rest assured I’ll be reporting back to you on it! grin

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Posted: 05 April 2005 10:21 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 7 ]  
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[quote author=“TheChampion”]We’re rather harsh today. Having a bad day?

Send me the links. I’ll try to keep an open mind. But if they attempt to twist history and throw a little lie in every truth, rest assured I’ll be reporting back to you on it! grin

You never had one.  How can you keep what you never had?

Oh, I’m sure we can count on you to report back.

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Posted: 05 April 2005 10:33 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 8 ]  
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Maybe TheChamp actually IS Sam Harris and he’s just posing as someone of a lower intelligence in order to keep us attempting to argue with him for the purpose of some further research for another project he’s working on. Suppose?

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Posted: 05 April 2005 10:45 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 9 ]  
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[quote author=“TheChampion”]
Wow, now that is some interesting stuff! “With evolution, facts follow theories….”

First of all, this guy is clearly not one of “our” own, as you put it, by which I take you to mean anyone who considers evolution to be plausible. Furthermore, although some over-enthusiastic scientists may refer to evolution as a fact, in the end it is still a theory. It has not been proven to be true beyond any possible doubt and it is not the answer to everything. Like most scientific theories, many questions remain.

With regard to the article, the author is clearly irresponsible in his reporting. He refers to “scientists”, as if all Darwinian biologists agree about everything, but there is only one paleontologist quoted. There is no link or citation to the original report of the discovery or any other supporting material, so we just have to take the author’s word for it.

The biggest problem with the article is the claim that the facts “are simply adapted to fit the theories”. Nothing in the article supports this claim. In fact, if you read the article carefully, it becomes clear that the author is attempting to make the facts fit his theory that evolution is false.

The scientist that he quotes doesn’t distort any of the facts. As any good scientist should do, he applies the theory of evolution to explain the facts. Nothing in evolution requires that life forms must constantly change. This discovery about the sea turtles isn’t even anything new. According to available evidence, alligators and crocodiles seem to have been around, nearly unchanged, since the days of the dinosaurs. The sea turtles are just another life form that seems to be unusually well-suited to its environment.

Then, as if to trumpet his ignorance of the even the most basic elements of theory of evolution to the whole world, he proclaims “It’s amazing they haven’t taken over the world, isn’t it?” One of the basic ideas of the theory of evolution is that each species selects for survival, not dominance. A species doesn’t have to dominate its environment, or even be near the top of the food chain, in order to be well-suited to its environment. If evolution required that every species of plant and animal had to dominate it’s own environment (much less “the whole world”), then only one plant or animal would exist in each environment. If every life form had to be at the top of the food chain, then there would be no food chain.


As an aside, it seems to me that most people who question what the bible says have a good working knowledge of the bible (and the bible is NOT an easy book to read).  But it seems to me that most of the detractors of the theory of evolution don’t seem to have even a basic knowledge about the details of the theory.

- Bulldog

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Posted: 05 April 2005 11:21 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 10 ]  
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Furthermore, although some over-enthusiastic scientists may refer to evolution as a fact, in the end it is still a theory. It has not been proven to be true beyond any possible doubt and it is not the answer to everything. Like most scientific theories, many questions remain.

Before you put out ideas like this, I suggest you discover for yourself the facts about what constitutes a scientific theory.  Evolution is as much a fact as relativity, and you should know that.  There is no serious doubt about evolution in the scientific community, and evolution is the absolute foundation of modern biology, and other sciences.  There is only healthy discussion and disagreement about the details.

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Posted: 05 April 2005 11:32 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 11 ]  
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Maybe its time for Champ to explain how he understands evolution.

Champ you constantly infer on this board we have no knowledge of the Bible, which many of us do, not only the Bible, but the pyschology of faith, the history of the Mid-east, the history and dogmas and holy books of religions other than Christianity, the history of the world, the development of primitive religions, anthropology, ect…

But I would like to hear IN your own words what you think the theory of evolution is.

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Posted: 05 April 2005 11:58 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 12 ]  
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That was a movie, but actually, no, I am NOT Sam Harris, ha ha. If I was, with his intellect, I’d be Billy Graham about now. How flattering though, made my day.

Iisbliss, I’ll get back to you on that. No links yet, what will “blow my mind.”

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Posted: 05 April 2005 12:01 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 13 ]  
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[quote author=“hampsteadpete”]
I suggest you discover for yourself the facts about what constitutes a scientific theory.  Evolution is as much a fact as relativity, and you should know that.

I assume you are referring to Einstein’s theory of relativity. Try to find a reputable physics book that doesn’t refer to it as such.
Newtonian physics works so well that for a long time, it seemed to explain everything. Then someone invented a powerful enough telescope and scientists started seeing strange things happening in strong gravity fields that utterly defied Newton’s theories. Then Einstein came along and figured out how to account for the irregularities. For a time, it appeared that everything we saw could be accounted for by relativity. Someone invented a better microscope and quantum physics was born. People are going to keep inventing improved methods of gathering data about the world and we have no way to be certain that we won’t find something that defies Einstein’s theories. So we cannot responsibly assert that relativity is a fact. It is simply the best explanation that fits the evidence so far. It is a theory because it may have to change.

Similarly, Darwin’s theory of evolution doesn’t explain everything, so it is irresponsible science to assume that it will never be found to be deficient in some way. However, it is reasonable to assume it is a fact in order to find corrolaries or to explore related areas of research. There are mountains of evidence that evolution does a very good job of explaining and no convincing evidence has arisen to disprove the theory, but just because we haven’t seen any evidence that the theory can’t explain doesn’t mean one doesn’t exist. It is just the best explanation for the facts that anyone has come up with so far.

The assertion “evolution is a fact”, is as unscientific as the assertion that “the bible is the revealed word of the creator of the universe”. We still don’t have all the facts and we probably never will.

- Bulldog

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Posted: 05 April 2005 12:12 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 14 ]  
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[quote author=“bulldog”][quote author=“TheChampion”]
Wow, now that is some interesting stuff! “With evolution, facts follow theories….”

First of all, this guy is clearly not one of “our” own, as you put it, by which I take you to mean anyone who considers evolution to be plausible. Furthermore, although some over-enthusiastic scientists may refer to evolution as a fact, in the end it is still a theory. It has not been proven to be true beyond any possible doubt and it is not the answer to everything. Like most scientific theories, many questions remain.

- Bulldog

Well if this is coming from a non-believer, then our schools are really doing a horrible job.  Bulldog, just what do you think a scientific theory is?  What does it mean in science to have a proof?  What is an answer to everything in science?  Moreover, what is an over-enthusiastic scientist?

Fact is, this kind of statement just fuels the fire folks.

Perhaps before claiming knowledge and understanding it would be a good idea to actual acquire some!

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Posted: 05 April 2005 12:40 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 15 ]  
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Champ, as I said at the end of my post about the links, I’m not going to bother.  Quite frankly, I have better things to do than play with the kiddies.

Bye,

Pete

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