The Republican Religious Right?
Posted: 18 April 2005 01:54 PM   [ Ignore ]  
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Is seems that Republican Party and the Religious Right are almost becoming synonomous both in the news and also in this forum.  While alalm with the leanings and membership of (some)  Republicans in the ranks of Religious Right is certainly appropiate, a vote against any Republican, could be a vote for the Religious Right. Case in point:

My state representatrive is:

1. The Founder and current minister at a funamentalist church.
2. Sponsored a bill in the state legislatue for funding of faith-based initiatives
3. A member and activist in organizations supporting parochial racial interests.
4.  Is a Democrat.

Stay Well
Wot

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Posted: 18 April 2005 05:47 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 1 ]  
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In other words, you have to know who you’re voting for.<g> That’s always a sensible idea.

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Posted: 18 April 2005 05:57 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 2 ]  
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Hey, there is really only two parties in our system. That leaves a lot of room for errors and mistakes on both sides. All things considered, I say vote Republican.

Until the dems display some form of class, some respect for those across the aisle, stop the half truths, and under handed politics, only then can they be considered fit for office. Until they, they have the deserved reputation of lacking any sort of decorum or class. We simply cannot allow them to represent our country to the world.

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Posted: 18 April 2005 11:38 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 3 ]  
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MJ said:

In other words, you have to know who you’re voting for.<g> That’s always a sensible idea.


I guess that is the simplistic view.  The next level of detail requires probing deeply to find out affiliations, bill sponsored, voting records and activisms. Party affiliation says nothing reliable.

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Wot

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Posted: 21 April 2005 04:59 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 4 ]  
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The Republicans tolerance for minorities and women is way too low for me to join them yet.

Maybe if the Christians in the party prove they are tolerant and generous and treat ALL PEOPLE as the children of God, I would think about changing, but as long as it appears Christians support predijuice, bigotry, and the subserviance of women and minorities, they wont get my vote.

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Posted: 22 April 2005 11:01 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 5 ]  
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Iisbliss wrote:

The Republicans tolerance for minorities and women is way too low for me to join them yet.

Maybe if the Christians in the party prove they are tolerant and generous and treat ALL PEOPLE as the children of God, I would think about changing, but as long as it appears Christians support predijuice, bigotry, and the subserviance of women and minorities, they wont get my vote.

I think this assumes that Democrats and liberals have such tolerance and that such tolerance is both sincere and reliable.

Consider:

Many leftists have an intense identification with the problems of groups that have an image of being weak (women), defeated (American Indians), repellent (homosexuals) or otherwise inferior. The leftists themselves feel that these groups are inferior. They would never admit to themselves that they have such feelings, but it is precisely because they do see these groups as inferior that they identify with their problems. (We do not mean to suggest that women, Indians, etc. ARE inferior; we are only making a point about leftist psychology.)

Leftists tend to hate anything that has an image of being strong, good and successful. They hate America, they hate Western civilization, they hate white males, they hate rationality. The reasons that leftists give for hating the West, etc. clearly do not correspond with their real motives. They SAY they hate the West because it is warlike, imperialistic, sexist, ethnocentric and so forth, but where these same faults appear in socialist countries or in primitive cultures, the leftist finds excuses for them, or at best he GRUDGINGLY admits that they exist; whereas he ENTHUSIASTICALLY points out (and often greatly exaggerates) these faults where they appear in Western civilization. Thus it is clear that these faults are not the leftist’s real motive for hating America and the West. He hates America and the West because they are strong and successful.

Words like “self-confidence,” “self-reliance,” “initiative,” “enterprise,” “optimism,” etc., play little role in the liberal and leftist vocabulary. The leftist is anti-individualistic, pro-collectivist. He wants society to solve everyone’s problems for them, satisfy everyone’s needs for them, take care of them. He is not the sort of person who has an inner sense of confidence in his own ability to solve his own problems and satisfy his own needs. The leftist is antagonistic to the concept of competition because, deep inside, he feels like a loser.

Stay Well
Wot

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Posted: 22 April 2005 03:52 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 6 ]  
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This quote was obviously written by someone who sees no grey areas.
Judging from it’s breathtaking stupidity,there may be a paucity of gray matter at work,as well. The author may actually be a member of the promethean society. If so,this quote represents one of the most krakatoa-like brain farts in history. To be initially fair,the author uses the words “MANY LEFTISTS”. This is most likely the tawdry old tactic
of covering one’s tracks so nobody can accuse them of being a
monolithic moron. The reader will still be persuaded,atleast subliminally
to believe this means,“the overwhelming majority of leftists.” Thus the
author has done their job and fooled the sleeping sheeple once again. Since I find
it doubtful that the author actually believes their own Forest Gumpian
drivel,one would think I could not justly accuse the author of blatant
stupidity. However,if the author actually believes any person not in
REM sleep and with two neurons to rub together actually buys this
verbal swampland,I would call them a buffoon of the highest order.


  Since every sentence of this quote oozes with a more sickly pottage
than Jacob ever did sell Esau,it is hardly worth dignifying with a response.
Nevertheless and Notwithstanding,terms like “the left” and “the right” are
virtually meaningless. Where precisely does a member of the “Nazi green
Party” stand? That said, there are all sorts of saints, devils,kooks,psychos,
geniuses,dunces,nincompoops and everthing in between and infinetly beyond that claim to be the member of some particular group/ideology etc…Let’s assume a “true left” actually does exist(I believe some basic criteria can be found,but it’s rather nebulous). The best I can do is provide subjectivity in regards to what leftism/liberalism/progressivism
means to me. The individuals (if they in fact exist at all in any significant#) that are described in this quote are about
as far from what I would consider a “true leftist” as generalissmo Francisco Franco.

  I for one hardly view women as “weak”. To the contrary,I think the modern western female,especially if she is relatively intelligent,educated
and attractive is one of the most fortunate and powerful humans in the
modern world.The only reason women are oppressed is because men
still do hold somewhat more power,money and influence and men are
generally physically stronger. These are not “perceptions” of “weakness”,they are facts. You can claim women have relative equality
in the USA. I am willing to bet there are many good conservative gals who may not agree so readily. The plain and simple
facts are ,women in the west have just as much ABILITY to rise
to the “top”,if not more than men. The OPPORTUNITIES are the only
things holding them back somewhat. How on earth does it follow,then
that I, as your friendy neighbourhood representative of the “LEFT”, view
women as “weaker” than men in any meaningful way. Mere brawn hardly
qualifies,many people with down’s syndrome have atleast that.


  I have never claimed the “socialist paradises” are/were anything but
monstrous failures and horribly oppressive. What exactly is the author talking about? If they mean stalin’s russia or the soviet system in general,as compared to the USA,it is like comparing nazi germany
(As the soviets) to Fascist Italy (As the USA). HOWEVER,if you take
a relatively miserable regime like the modern(post- Mao) PRC against
the United States and ask “what nation-state has caused/allowed more
human misery,injustice etc…I think the only reason China may score higher on the overall “misery index”(this includes environmental impacts and wars) is because they have more people.Let’s see
20,000 murders per year,40,000 auto deaths per-year countless deaths/injuries/illnesses from preventable workplace injuries,medical malpractice,prescription drugs, enviromental toxins like the Strontium 90 that dentists are finding in children’s teeth here in south florida in very high concentrations. This is very likely the result of Turkey Point nuclear power plant that is right by the major agricultural region where we get much of our produce.Oh, and before I forget, there is also a exceptionally high level
of childhood leukemias in this area. Shall I go on? The farcial “war on drugs” that is destroying some of the world’s richest biodiversity in the world in Columbia and other areas of South america.Not to mention solving little and wasting our tax dollars(please don’t pat uncle sam on the back,because” drug use has declined so much”).And Please don’t try to tell me this is chomskyian propaganda,i’ve seen it with my OWN eyes along with my plant biologist uncle and a team of other credible and impartial scientists. A travesty that masquerades as a justice system,35 million people in poverty,vietnam,laos,cambodia,central america,the phillipines,indoneisa,etc…ad nauseum. I could fill up twenty more posts so i’ll stop now. I am NOT saying america or the west in general, is any more guilty than many other places/people/states etc… There are glaring pros and cons everywhere. But,really what in “god’s” name does
this country need to be responsible for another holocaust perhaps, before
some of you wake up and see it’s not quite the shining “city on the hill.“In fact,it’s just one more state of the rich and priveledged and for the rich and priveledged.That’s pretty much what every nation-state,empire and every other “high"civilization has been since Sumerian times. I am not saying nation-states are absolute evil either,it’s all pretty much about duality and thesis-antithesis-synthesis. And no,communist and socialist
states are no exception.Oh yes and please say containing communism or
“the domino theory” was a justification for the USA directly/indirectly causing the deaths,injuries,etc… of countless millions.our history. I guess that means the wealthiest country on the earth is exempt from cleaning up all the unexploded ordanance in places like Laos where it still kills hundreds of people a year JUST IN LAOS. BTW,all of this and the whole rest of the iceberg that goes with it, is just considering the last 40 years or so of US history.

    I can’t imagine what this author is thinking when they accuse leftists of hating “power”,“success” and all that other balderdash. As a leftist, the problem I have is with those who don’t deserve their priveledges and I side with people who,through no fault of their own ARE weak and are often preyed upon by the undeserving fortunates.This again includes the enviroment since I abandoned the judeo-christian anthromophoric worldview a long time ago. The corporations and individuals often tell us what “wonders” NAFTA has done for the poor
in Mexico and elsewhere. They say, “it’s given them jobs and economic
power they otherwise would not have”. Sorry folks,another rancid lie,i’ve been to mexico to and i’ve seen the happy lives of the wage-slaves for
US/western companies. They can only hope to rise to the glorious existence of america’s working poor. And ofcourse,the companies take full advantage of the lax environmental provisions and turn the communities that these people live and work into toxic cesspools.

  I suppose many of you think this is just going on in Mexico,think again.
Oh and as for this legendary nietzchean superman,aka the “american winner” the author claims we lefties are so envious of,you really can’t be serious!?!?! Many of the biggest “nothings” and “losers” I’ve ever known were fairly well-off,if not filthy rich.

They had no other great ability than to make and keep their money and often were pretty crappy at that too. I personally know a 38 y/o furniture mover who is far more of a polymath
than ANY RICH person i’ve ever PERSONALLY known. He just finds his music(he plays several instruments with zero formal training) more important than making oodles of cash. I’m not irrational enough to suggest that there are not plenty of rich folks like him;but if the author really thinks a true lefty is somehow jealous of people just because they are financially successful and/or have some prestigious college degree,he/she is really all wet.


  Jealously and envy is pretty common among humans,on the left,right,middle and every other direction. I guess the author believes lefties have a genetic predisposition for envy!!I really don’t consider
myself an exceptionally jealous/envious person,but i’m not going
totally deny it’s existence within me. If you REALLY want a good shot
at incurring my envy,you better produce the goods!!! Your education,your background,your pompous airs,what you know about modern art and “ethnicky jazz”,your clothes and your money mean squat to me. Strip it all away and show me what your made of. Have you got the ability to build a log cabin in the alaskan wilderness from scratch? What about a billion other intellectual,physical,creative,moral and character-proving rigors?

Conquer a few things with flying colors in a few of these categories and then you may engender some of my envy. Frankly,I have zero problem finding people EVERYDAY better than me in numerous ways. I also find plenty who are worse in many ways.It really does’nt even normally enter either my consciousness and from the several neuropsych exams i’ve taken,it doesn’t seem to effect me much on a subconscious level either. Well once again, I have been FLOORED by the spectacular,inexpressible ignorance and plain stupidity of some people. That seems to be happening alot lately. That anyone with an IQ above 75 would take this quote as really representative of genuinely
decent and respectable people (like Nader) who would claim to be progressive (IOW, the evil L word) surpasses my comprehension.
You might find this kind of thing in the phony demoratic party and
the hollywood-marin county “liberal”,hypocritical ,jerk-offs who have benefitted more from this nation and it’s economic system than most
right-wingers.I don’t think you will see much of it among the people
who have really been in the trenches all these years.

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Posted: 22 April 2005 08:08 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 7 ]  
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More from the same author. Not agreeing or disagreeing, I offer it only as potentially interesting material:

Modern leftish philosophers tend to dismiss reason, science, objective reality and to insist that everything is culturally relative. It is true that one can ask serious questions about the foundations of scientific knowledge and about how, if at all, the concept of objective reality can be defined. But it is obvious that modern leftish philosophers are not simply cool-headed logicians systematically analyzing the foundations of knowledge. They are deeply involved emotionally in their attack on truth and reality. They attack these concepts because of their own psychological needs. For one thing, their attack is an outlet for hostility, and, to the extent that it is successful, it satisfies the drive for power. More importantly, the leftist hates science and rationality because they classify certain beliefs as true (i.e., successful, superior) and other beliefs as false (i.e. failed, inferior). The leftist’s feelings of inferiority run so deep that he cannot tolerate any classification of some things as successful or superior and other things as failed or inferior. This also underlies the rejection by many leftists of the concept of mental illness and of the utility of IQ tests. Leftists are antagonistic to genetic explanations of human abilities or behavior because such explanations tend to make some persons appear superior or inferior to others. Leftists prefer to give society the credit or blame for an individual’s ability or lack of it. Thus if a person is “inferior” it is not his fault, but society’s, because he has not been brought up properly.

The leftist is not typically the kind of person whose feelings of inferiority make him a braggart, an egotist, a bully, a self-promoter, a ruthless competitor. This kind of person has not wholly lost faith in himself. He has a deficit in his sense of power and self-worth, but he can still conceive of himself as having the capacity to be strong, and his efforts to make himself strong produce his unpleasant behavior.  But the leftist is too far gone for that. His feelings of inferiority are so ingrained that he cannot conceive of himself as individually strong and valuable. Hence the collectivism of the leftist. He can feel strong only as a member of a large organization or a mass movement with which he identifies himself.

Notice the masochistic tendency of leftist tactics. Leftists protest by lying down in front of vehicles, they intentionally provoke police or racists to abuse them, etc. These tactics may often be effective, but many leftists use them not as a means to an end but because they PREFER masochistic tactics. Self-hatred is a leftist trait.

Leftists may claim that their activism is motivated by compassion or by moral principles, and moral principle does play a role for the leftist of the oversocialized type. But compassion and moral principle cannot be the main motives for leftist activism. Hostility is too prominent a component of leftist behavior; so is the drive for power. Moreover, much leftist behavior is not rationally calculated to be of benefit to the people whom the leftists claim to be trying to help. For example, if one believes that affirmative action is good for black people, does it make sense to demand affirmative action in hostile or dogmatic terms? Obviously it would be more productive to take a diplomatic and conciliatory approach that would make at least verbal and symbolic concessions to white people who think that affirmative action discriminates against them. But leftist activists do not take such an approach because it would not satisfy their emotional needs. Helping black people is not their real goal. Instead, race problems serve as an excuse for them to express their own hostility and frustrated need for power. In doing so they actually harm black people, because the activists’ hostile attitude toward the white majority tends to intensify race hatred.

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Wot

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Posted: 22 April 2005 09:34 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 8 ]  
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I know you said you neither agree or disargee,Wot but I truly am speechless. I guess pro-lifers and the Terry Schiavo crowd never lay
down in front of cars and all that foolishness. While I freely admit
this author has probably got the number of some “leftists” (as well as a whole host of other “ists” and “isms”). It all sounds like poorly conceived
commentary on human folly and underlying motivations in general. I really can’t and won’t say much else,it’s just fairly typical right-wing
propaganda,just infinetly more baseless. I’ll bet my a** it’s straight from the pen of that vile, face- that- sank- a-thousand-ships, hellwitch coulter.

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Posted: 22 April 2005 10:14 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 9 ]  
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If you have read any of my posts before you will understand that I surely have a purpose.  Send a PM if you like.

Standby


Wot

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Posted: 23 April 2005 10:22 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 10 ]  
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I have read your previous posts. Unfortunetly, I cannot recall exactly what your stated purpose. I would prefer not to re-read the previous posts
in order to clearly ascertain your purpose. I would appreciate it if you could succinctly state your purpose. Thanks you in advance. smile

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