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You may be a Fundy-Atheist if…
Posted: 03 March 2007 02:24 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 31 ]  
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I would like to address the obvious hyperbole in this thread relating to the Torcaso v. Watkins supreme court case.

The Supreme Court DID NOT declare Secular Humanism a religion in its opinion, the statement was included in a dictum footnote by justice Black. See this link:

 

The ruling was really very pro first amendment, and is still cited today whenever some local or state government tries to create some sort of religious test for office.

This is from the link:

This decision prohibited the government from using religious faith as one of the criteria for assuming public office. The Court rejected the argument that holding such jobs is a privilege that can be restricted to people of some prescribed religious belief.

One of the reasons this case is important is some of the dicta which were attached to the final opinion. The term dicta is a plural and shortening of “obiter dictum,” or “said in passing.” Such statements are personal opinions of the justice - they are not necessary to the final result and have no legal force.

In a dictum footnote attached to this opinion, Justice Black wrote:

Among the religions in this country which do not teach what would generally be considered a belief in the existence of God are Buddhism, Taoism, Ethical Culture, Secular Humanism, and others.

This is frequently cited by people on the religious right as that the Supreme Court has declared Secular Humanism to be a religion, but such people are simply unaware of the fact that dicta have no legal force. Ignoring this uncomfortable fact, however, allows them to argue that any hint of Secular Humanism in schools is a violation of the separation of church and state - an ironic argument, since they would be happy to dispense with separation anyway.

 

If you want to quote the law, get your facts straight.  It is not so just because your christian web sites say it is

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Posted: 03 March 2007 03:36 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 32 ]  
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[quote author=“SavedbyGrace”]Mr Mark… maybe some time you could learn how to read the Word according to it’s language, and in context.
Then we can discuss whether I should hate you or not. =]


The typical Xian cop out defense, “you don’t know/haven’t studied/take out of context the Bible” meme.

Here’s the deal SBG: I’m 52. I was confirmed at age 13, “saved” at age 18. I was a strong believer until I hit my 30s when I considered myself a deist. By mid-40s, I was an atheist.

How did I get there? By constant study of the scriptures. Like you, my initial studies were nothing but exercises in reinforcing the crap the church had taught me since my youth. As I matured and began to see more of the world, I expanded my study to include different views on Xianity and religions in general. Eventually, I reached the point where the lies and idiocies of religion became all too apparent.

And here I stand today.

Please do not infer that I am misreading the Bible or taking it out of context. Quite the opposite. In fact, I would be willing to bet that my knowledge of the Bible exceeds yours by quite a stretch. I say that based on what you write in your posts here: it’s the same uninformed, limited vision, agenda-driven drivel that I heard from the fundies during my late teens and twenties. The truth is that you are stuck in the politically informed phase of religious belief, and that is quite a ways off from a more-spiritually informed outlook on life. Sad, but true, my friend.

Do a little research and expand your horizons. You may be surprised where it leads you. Or do you prefer to quake in your boots over the prospect that your imaginary god may consign your imaginary soul to an imaginary hell for eternity?

Here’s a good place for you to start on the road to spiritual recovery ( http://tinyurl.com/34amgh ), but I doubt that you’ll bother reading this. You’re simply scared shitless at the proposition that your religious beliefs are a house of cards.

[ Edited: 03 March 2007 07:48 AM by ]
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Posted: 03 March 2007 03:57 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 33 ]  
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[quote author=“Monik”][quote author=“follower of the Way”]Atheism was declared a religion by the Supreme Court in a 2005 case. Visit this website: http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=45874

I don’t know, it sounds to me as if the judge was enabling the prisoners in question to form an atheist study group by using the existing law and defining atheism as a religion. Regardless, I doubt many atheists themselves would think of it that (I wouldn’t, anyway!).


Exactly. The problem is the special privilege religion gets in our society. I think the same serious and obvious flaw is written into the law regarding conscientious objection. If I’m not mistaken (and I hope I am) it has to be based upon religion in order to be legally recognized—or at least that’s the only definition specifically recognized.

Here are some other examples —yet of course we all know that Christians are terribly persecuted here in the us.

rolleyes

Byron

[ Edited: 03 March 2007 04:19 AM by ]
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Posted: 03 March 2007 04:11 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 34 ]  
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This is perhaps the ugliest, darkest, most destructive and harmful aspect of Christianity.

SavedbyGrace - 02 March 2007 10:30 PM

Maybe I should also make something else clear.
I don’t claim to be perfect, or any better than any one of you.
I don’t even claim to be a good person.
I’m a rotten, dirty, sinful, lying, theiving, adulterous, hateful idiot that deserves nothing more than eternity in a miserable, hot hell.
By nothing more than the dear grace of God, I won’t get what I deserve though.


Translation, sans window dressing:
Although I must be precisely as God created me because He’s perfect and omnipotent and the creator of all things, I’m a loathsome being worthy of profound eternal torment. I’m also somehow responsible for being precisely as I was created, and I need to feel deeply guilty and self-loathing.

This is what faith enables an otherwise healthy human mind to believe. What a horrible and irrational way to live and conceive of the rest of Humanity! It explains a great deal of Christian behavior and thought.

Byron


- formatting (which was altered in the software upgrade) fixed

[ Edited: 18 November 2008 05:21 PM by SkepticX]
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“We say, ‘Love your brother…’ We don’t say it really, but… Well we don’t literally say it. We don’t really, literally mean it. No, we don’t believe it either, but… But that message should be clear.”—David St. Hubbins

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Posted: 04 March 2007 09:02 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 35 ]  
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Many of these are strangly sepcific. I see your goal here, you are trying to be funny and say that many, if not all, or us here are “fundamentalist atheists”. Alot of your examples are way to specific.

Also, many of your claims could apply to theists (believing in evolution).


This was all and all, a strange post.

Maybe I should also make something else clear.
I don’t claim to be perfect, or any better than any one of you.
I don’t even claim to be a good person.
I’m a rotten, dirty, sinful, lying, theiving, adulterous, hateful idiot that deserves nothing more than eternity in a miserable, hot hell.
By nothing more than the dear grace of God, I won’t get what I deserve though.

Wow, that sounds like a sad life. I feel bad for you.

I guess I was lucky enough to be born perfect. What are the odds. Billions of possible DNA combinations and I end up with the one for a perfect human being, wow. Thank Zeus, thats some good luck.

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Posted: 16 November 2008 10:06 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 36 ]  
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When was the last time you saw calculators having sex?

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“There is undoubtedly an important secular debate to be had about the ethics of the death penalty…” -Sam Harris
“There is undoubtedly an important secular debate to be had about the ethics of embryonic stem cell research and abortion…” -Me

Jump through the Blackmun Hole!

Salt Creek has discovered the meaning of the first half of “Nulono”. Now, what language uses “nul” for zero?

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Posted: 16 November 2008 11:00 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 37 ]  
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Nulono - 16 November 2008 03:06 PM

When was the last time you saw calculators having sex?

Nulono - 10 November 2008 12:37 PM

STOP POSTING!!! I’M NOT READING ANY OF THESE!!!

The only reason I started this thread was to point out that pro-life atheists exist..

Look everybody - pro-life atheists exist!

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Posted: 18 November 2008 07:51 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 38 ]  
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SkepticX - 03 March 2007 09:11 AM

This is perhaps the ugliest, darkest, most destructive and harmful aspect of Christianity.

[quote author=“SavedbyGrace”]Maybe I should also make something else clear.
I don’t claim to be perfect, or any better than any one of you.
I don’t even claim to be a good person.
I’m a rotten, dirty, sinful, lying, theiving, adulterous, hateful idiot that deserves nothing more than eternity in a miserable, hot hell.
By nothing more than the dear grace of God, I won’t get what I deserve though.


Translation, sans window dressing:
Although I must be precisely as God created me because He’s perfect and omnipotent and the creator of all things, I’m a loathsome being worthy of profound eternal torment. I’m also somehow responsible for being precisely as I was created, and I need to feel deeply guilty and self-loathing.

This is what faith enables an otherwise healthy human mind to believe. What a horrible and irrational way to live and conceive of the rest of Humanity! It explains a great deal of Christian behavior and thought.

Byron

Amen!  Preach on, Brother Byron!

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“It isn’t paranoia- it’s a heightened awareness of reality.” —our resident conspiracy theorist takes a stand!

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Posted: 18 November 2008 05:09 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 39 ]  
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SkepticX - 03 March 2007 09:11 AM

This is perhaps the ugliest, darkest, most destructive and harmful aspect of Christianity.

[quote author=“SavedbyGrace”]Maybe I should also make something else clear.
I don’t claim to be perfect, or any better than any one of you.
I don’t even claim to be a good person.
I’m a rotten, dirty, sinful, lying, theiving, adulterous, hateful idiot that deserves nothing more than eternity in a miserable, hot hell.
By nothing more than the dear grace of God, I won’t get what I deserve though.


Translation, sans window dressing:
Although I must be precisely as God created me because He’s perfect and omnipotent and the creator of all things, I’m a loathsome being worthy of profound eternal torment. I’m also somehow responsible for being precisely as I was created, and I need to feel deeply guilty and self-loathing.

This is what faith enables an otherwise healthy human mind to believe. What a horrible and irrational way to live and conceive of the rest of Humanity! It explains a great deal of Christian behavior and thought.

Byron

My mother missed being born in Scotland by about a year, but her devotion to Calvinism indicates she didn’t miss by much.  One of my favorite singers, Dick Gaughan, sings Yew Tree, about the history of Scotland.  A relevant lyric:

Did ye no think tae tell when John Knox himsel
Preached under your branches sae black
Tae the puir common folk who would cast off the yoke
O the bishops an priests fae their backs?
But you knew the bargain he sold them
An freedom was only one part,
For the price o their souls was a gospel sae cold
It would freeze aa the joy in their hearts.

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“I am one of the few people I know who has argued in print that torture may be an ethical necessity in our war on terror.”  Sam Harris October 17, 2005

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