Sam Harris

Nhoj Morley

Work has been busy. I told myself no more Harris-ing while I’m supposed to be working.

time is money, Thank you for your time
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dlsmith

They might be able to create a clone of “you”, but it would not be “you” in any other sense, just like identical twins can have different personalities.

I am saying, that they will be able to save your personality entirely and give you a body again.

Carstonio

The problem with using theory to “prove” God’s existence is this - theists define God as forever beyond empirical science, so any theory is untestable.

I found out that even if you start with science God is the final destination.
How far science wants to go in the universe control?
Answer: total control of the universe.

Imagine in 15 century if Cristobal Colon say: the earth is round and if I go west I will find India.

Waltercat will say:  “why would anyone believe such nonsense?”

Salt Creek and J.B.S Haldane will say: “People who claim fairies exist are not only dumber than we suppose, they’re dumber than we can suppose.”

Dlsmith will say:  “Millienia of pain, suffering, fear, murder, torture, ignorance and deceit. Brought to you by your local place of worship”.

Carstonio will say:  “your theory is untestable”.

Antisocialdarwinist will say:  “your going …. (Sound of flushing toilet)”

Jefe will say: “We don’t know, and making assumptions, leaps of faith or belief statements born of ignorance and/or wishful thinking doesn’t change the fact that we don’t know”

Sam Harris will say: “93 percent of the members of the National Academy of Sciences may well be doomed for eternity by their skepticism”.

So is your choice, do you want to sail or stay?

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Revelation 1:8

“I am the Alpha and the Omega, the Beginning and the End,” says the Lord, “who is and who was and who is to come, the Almighty”

[quote author=“netred972”]So is your choice, do you want to sail or stay?

Seems like you are sailing against the tide, netred. Hope floats your boat. You need a map. Or a nap. Or something.

Imagine in 15 century if Cristobal Colon say: the earth is round and if I go west I will find India.

Imagine if people stopped making analogies between imaginary things and real things.

“Imagination is more important than knowledge…” Albert Einstein

Salt Creek

Imagine if people stopped making analogies between imaginary things and real things.

[quote author=“netred972”]“Imagination is more important than knowledge…” Albert Einstein

Yeah, but this presumes that you have some knowledge, too. What Albert did not say is: “Imagination is a substitute for knowledge.”  Imagination without knowledge is worthless.

[quote author=“Salt Creek”][quote author=“netred972”]“Imagination is more important than knowledge…” Albert Einstein

Yeah, but this presumes that you have some knowledge, too. What Albert did not say is: “Imagination is a substitute for knowledge.”  Imagination without knowledge is worthless.

“Oh, Man! If you only knew how often the false fantasies of the imagination are closer to the truth than the careful conclusions of the cautious, and how these truths are of no service until the imaginer, having done his work with the imagination, becomes less imaginative.”  Shah Pak (quoted in Idries Shah, Wisdom of the Idiots).

Imagination as a congnitive process is valuable. Imagined fictitious facts are worthless.

As well you know, rogerflat. You’ve demonstrated how one can grow a powerful attachment to fictitious facts .

To me is common sense, to avoid endless discussions we just need to establish our beliefs

“Science wants to control the universe”

Netred972———————————YES[x]  NO []

Jefe——————————————YES [  ]    NO [  ]
Antisocialdarwinist——————YES [  ]    NO [  ]
Carstonio———————————YES [  ]    NO [  ]
Dlsmith————————————- YES [  ]    NO [  ]
Waltercat———————————- YES [  ]    NO [  ]
Salt Creek———————————YES [  ]    NO [  ]
Rogerflat————————————YES [  ]    NO [  ]
Mia———————————————-YES [  ]    NO [  ]
Sam Harris———————————YES [  ]    NO [  ]
any other———————————-YES[  ]    NO [  ]

I hope atheists can answer a simple yes or no question.
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Revelation 1:8

“I am the Alpha and the Omega, the Beginning and the End,” says the Lord, “who is and who was and who is to come, the Almighty”

[quote author=“netred972”]1) Every thing is going to die.
2) Life is going to take control over the universe, and the last step will be an Almighty being, with the power to go back on time and be the first of the creation, to be the father and the son at the same time.

Number 1 is the only option. Unless some heretofore unknown property of matter is discovered, all the matter in the universe will eventually, in say a googol (that’s 10 to the 100th power.) years, decay. Nothing can stop that from happening, especially some spooky “Almighty being,” since such an entity does not exist.

And just for the sake of entertainment, if he did exist, why did he design the universe to self destruct? Seems sort of short sighted to me.

[quote author=“netred972”]To me is common sense, to avoid endless discussions we just need to establish our beliefs

“Science wants to control the universe”

Netred972———————————YES[x]  NO []

Jefe——————————————YES [  ]    NO [  ]
Antisocialdarwinist——————YES [  ]    NO [  ]
Carstonio———————————YES [  ]    NO [  ]
Dlsmith————————————- YES [  ]    NO [X]
Waltercat———————————- YES [  ]    NO [  ]
Salt Creek———————————YES [  ]    NO [  ]
Rogerflat————————————YES [  ]    NO [  ]
Mia———————————————-YES [  ]    NO [  ]
Sam Harris———————————YES [  ]    NO [  ]
any other———————————-YES[  ]    NO [  ]

I hope atheists can answer a simple yes or no question.
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Not all simple questions can be answered with just a yes or no.

From what distorted frame of reference do you arrive at the conclusion that science wants to control the universe?

The mission of science is to learn how things work, to remove to mystery and superstition about workings of the universe. If man wants to use that knowledge to control the universe, which would by the way be a rather large public works project, or maybe just little parts of it, then that is his prerogative.

Science is not evil, only those who pervert it are.

[quote author=“netred972”]

“Science wants to control the universe”

I was waiting for a complete sentence before I responded.

Science can’t control the universe.  That is like saying Zoology wants to control the species!.  It don’t work dude.

All science is, is a way of rationally explaining the experience that we all share using a method that is agreed upon by a large group of people.  Peers. 

Everything else is speculation and chasing Mythologies ‘round the block.  You might as well be asking why the earth is the back of a turtle. Science cannot control the universe, but through it, we might be able to understand how it works.  Much more so than we would be able to using old iron age mythologies.

You employ a scientific method, you do not control the universe, you seek to understand it.  You learn that the earth rests not on a turtle, but in a little depression of space/time (it created it anyway, why not rest there).

Well, just chiming in, and I hope you find some definite articles (and maybe a gerund or two) on your search for God.

I’m not trying to be an ass, I just am.

[quote author=“netred972”]“Science wants to control the universe”

That sounds like the premise of the next Tim LaHaye-Jim Jenkins series, with the scientists described using anti-Semitic stereotypes. (Aside: I recommend the weekly dissections of “Left Behind” on the Slacktivist blog.)

http://www.bp208.ca/winners2003/images/art/923.jpg 

check this link, 1930’s

32Then you will know the truth, and the truth will set you free.”

——————————————-

Revelation 1:8

“I am the Alpha and the Omega, the Beginning and the End,” says the Lord, “who is and who was and who is to come, the Almighty”

[quote author=“netred972”]I am saying, that they will be able to save your personality entirely and give you a body again.

And just how, might I ask do you propose to do that?

Unless they transplant your brain to a new body, even then the “new you” is only a copy. Your actual consciousness, memory and personality only reside in your brain and would not be transferred.

It’s not like backing up and restoring data on a computer, it’s a little more complicated than that.

[quote author=“netred972”]http://www.bp208.ca/winners2003/images/art/923.jpg 

check this link, 1930’s

That picture just shows that there were some good drugs even back in the 1930’s.

[quote author=“netred972”]32Then you will know the truth, and the truth will set you free.”

The Bible talking about truth and freedom, that’s a hoot.

Dlsmith  

Number 1 is the only option. Unless. . .

I see some hope here.

Jefe

I do know a few scientists who’s goals are to help humanity

What is the ultimate goal? Maybe The Fountain of Youth.

Dlsmith

I am saying, that they will be able to save your personality entirely and give you a body again.
And just how, might I ask do you propose to do that?

I propose that some one will find the way to do it.

Switch, Dlsmith, Jefe.

Science can’t control the universe

Ok, give me a goal limit of science to the future.

1.- Laboratory test.

2.- A city.

3.- A planet.

4.- A solar system.

5.- A galaxy.

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“Then you will know the truth, and the truth will set you free.”

Revelation 1:8

“I am the Alpha and the Omega, the Beginning and the End,” says the Lord, “who is and who was and who is to come, the Almighty”

...—-...    Sam Harris.