Sam Harris

“There are no atheists in foxholes” should be an argument against faith.

It’s certainly an argument in favor of stupidity.

It says far more about the speaker’s superficial position on god then on atheists.  Or fox holes.

toombaru - 18 August 2012 10:54 AM

“There are no atheists in foxholes” should be an argument against faith.

To me it means you’re so scared you can’t think straight about anything.

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Reason obeys itself; and ignorance submits to whatever is dictated to it. Thomas Paine 1737 - 1809

Pacifism will get you killed.  To that end, foxholes are necessary.

And they will be manned by atheists and theists alike, since it follows that atheist pacifism will get you killed just as much as theist pacifism.

toombaru - 18 August 2012 10:54 AM

“There are no atheists in foxholes” should be an argument against faith.

Obviously that you’ve defined the word atheist wrong.Anyway,if you’re against Atheist,then I might as well tell you that religious people have sinned and committed mistakes more intolerable than atheist have not done.

There are (hardly) any atheists in prison.

That should be what true moral people are noticing.

Ice Monkey - 20 August 2012 08:27 PM

It’s certainly an argument in favor of stupidity.

It says far more about the speaker’s superficial position on god then on atheists.  Or fox holes.

I wouldn’t necessarily equate a belief in ‘god’ with stupidity. Perhaps irrationality due to indoctrination from birth, coupled with a seemingly inherent human desire to believe in some greater power that supervises our existence.

Astral Weeks - 25 September 2012 09:31 PM

Ice Monkey - 20 August 2012 08:27 PM

It’s certainly an argument in favor of stupidity.

It says far more about the speaker’s superficial position on god then on atheists.  Or fox holes.

I wouldn’t necessarily equate a belief in ‘god’ with stupidity. Perhaps irrationality due to indoctrination from birth, coupled with a seemingly inherent human desire to believe in some greater power that supervises our existence.

I wasn’t.  I was, however, equating using the quoted statement (refer to the opening post) as an argument with stupidity.  This wasn’t a thread on the belief in a god, but a disbelief in one.

But for the record, I do think a certain level of stupidity contributes to the ongoing worship of imaginary characters.  It’s not the ignorant type of stupidity I ridicule people for.  It’s the self-inflicted stupidity of being presented with overwhelming evidence against your inherited position, and still clinging to it under the guise of faith, and proudly so.  It’s that sort of stupid person I go out of my way to lean on, especially in front of large groups of people.

Ice Monkey - 26 September 2012 02:16 AM

Astral Weeks - 25 September 2012 09:31 PM

Ice Monkey - 20 August 2012 08:27 PM

It’s certainly an argument in favor of stupidity.

It says far more about the speaker’s superficial position on god then on atheists.  Or fox holes.

I wouldn’t necessarily equate a belief in ‘god’ with stupidity. Perhaps irrationality due to indoctrination from birth, coupled with a seemingly inherent human desire to believe in some greater power that supervises our existence.

I wasn’t.  I was, however, equating using the quoted statement (refer to the opening post) as an argument with stupidity.  This wasn’t a thread on the belief in a god, but a disbelief in one.

But for the record, I do think a certain level of stupidity contributes to the ongoing worship of imaginary characters.  It’s not the ignorant type of stupidity I ridicule people for.  It’s the self-inflicted stupidity of being presented with overwhelming evidence against your inherited position, and still clinging to it under the guise of faith, and proudly so.  It’s that sort of stupid person I go out of my way to lean on, especially in front of large groups of people.  I quite enjoy it.

I spent a year in Nam .... I’m Agnostic.

The claim “there are no atheists in foxholes” is and always has been a lie.

The First World War gave rise to French Existentialism and caused people to turn away from religion in record numbers. In fact, according to all the available data, war causes people, not only to leave religion, but to become sceptical.

My great-great-grandmother turned her back on religion because her baby died and the priest told her that, because the child hadn’t been baptised, its soul would be burnt and tormented for all eternity. She said, and I quote, “If your god is such a bastard that he’d torment something as sweet and innocent as a child for all eternity, then he’s no god of mine!”

That was in 1878.

That kind of sentiment would become very prevalent during and after the “Great War”. Why would god allow injustice? Why would god allow the killing of innocents? And so on.