Sam Harris

Hi Folks,

I just read a book called The Secret Societies Handbook by Michael Bradley.

One of the societies he talks about is Opus Dei, that has a big role in Dan Brown's The DeVinci Code.

Anyway, not only is it a "secret society" but has all the earmarks of being a religious cult. Members are aggressively recruited and recruiters use fear tactics and intimidation to get vulnerable people to join. They scare them with "eternal damnation" among other things.

Members flog themselves once a week with a whip on the butt, and they must also were a spiked chain around their upper thigh two hours a day!

They are discouraged from having contact with family members because they "wouldn't understand." All the money an Opus dei member makes goes into a pool and is doled out has the cult sees fit. There are no records kept of how much money goes out to members and what is kept and what its used for.

Read more…

http://www.odan.org/index.htm
http://btobsearch.barnesandnoble.com/booksearch/isbnInquiry.asp?z=y&btob=Y&endeca=1&isbn=0760762767&itm=9

They were on the cover of Time Magazine last week. Big secret.

Sounds like fun, if you’re into flogging yourself….

So frankr, tell us what the article said. Is it easier for you to kill a thread than have an intelligent debate or conversation?

What do you want me to say? Its a group of conservative catholics who choose to consecrate their daily work to God. They do so through prayer, charity and self sacrifice. They do not flog themseves, they use a macrame cord. The practice mortification by wearing a cillus. A light metal band around their leg for two hours a day. These are classic examples of spiritual sacrifices made by Christians over the centuries. It is a spiritual exercise. If one gets into the habit of making small sacrifices for God then one prepares oneself for the greates sacrifice to God. Take em or leave em they have their good points and bad like everybody else, but they are hardly doing anything radical or outlandish. Unless practicing your faith is outlandish. It may be in these parts. My point was that they are not really that secret.

frankr writes:
What do you want me to say? Its a group of conservative catholics who choose to consecrate their daily work to God. They do so through prayer, charity and self sacrifice. They do not flog themseves, they use a macrame cord. The practice mortification by wearing a cillus. A light metal band around their leg for two hours a day.

Sounds kind of cultish to me.  I am qualified somewhat to speak on the matter since I recently exited a cult.

Us vs Them mentality, black and white mentality, money pooling in the form of financial consecration with no accountability, “The world is an evil place and whew! aren’t we glad we are better than the world” type of mindset,  it’s all there.

Frankr writes: These are classic examples of spiritual sacrifices made by Christians over the centuries. It is a spiritual exercise.

Just another reason to end faith like this.  (Praise Mr. Harris! Heil!) 

Faith in it’s more subtle format has a sneaky way of morphing into wearing spikey leg cuffs for two hours every day.  I mean, what is wrong with just having plain old non leg cuff faith?  Why the radical separist leg cuff activity?  It’s just bizarre.  Does it really require a leg cuff to have faith?  There is a demonstrated unhealthy polarization going on there.

And when the spikey leg cuff fails to satisfy the man made void presented in the man made god concept, bizarre events in the name of this man mad god such as holy wars, inquisitions, witch burnings and our modern day example of suicide bombing crop up.

But… yes… let us allow the theist to perform his spiritual exercises.  It is his right to do so after all.

Run away freight train ahead!

If one gets into the habit of making small sacrifices for God then one prepares oneself for the greates sacrifice to God.

I am quite positive this is exactly what went through the lunatic 9/11 hijacker’s minds as they crashed the planes.

We simply must end the mechanism that breeds this faith.  It has got to stop.

Take em or leave em they have their good points and bad like everybody else, but they are hardly doing anything radical or outlandish. Unless practicing your faith is outlandish.

Is it really a quantum leap from spikey leg cuffs to radical fringe lunatic suicide bombers?

I mean, where do we draw the line as to what is an approved “spiritual exersize” and what is a fostering of a mental break from reality?  Since 9/11, should we not be a little more paranoid about this?  I am.

Noggin

Is it really a quantum leap from spikey leg cuffs to radical fringe lunatic suicide bombers?

yes

The whole self-mortification thing could almost be funny were it not for the influence Opus Dei wields. The secretary of state for education over here in the UK is a member…

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/4190115.stm

[quote author=“frankr”]

Noggin writes:
Is it really a quantum leap from spikey leg cuffs to radical fringe lunatic suicide bombers?

Frankr responds:
yes

Hi

I grow nervous when I see any faith begin to escalate in evolutionary terms.  It’s happening slowly in some religions but more quickly in others.

Where does it end?  First there was plain old Catholicism.  That wasn’t enough so in 1928 some priest in Madrid starts an upper echelon version of Catholicism (in my opinion).

Christianity used to be plain old christianity until recently we see the birth of “spiritual exercises” such as 40 day food fasts and actually having one’s self crucified in order to draw nearer to god.

I have the links to those examples if you want them.

It could be that there is a void in religion that just never gets filled adequately.  The atheists see this plainly because we believe god does not exist.  So why are people nailing themselves to crosses, going without food for forty days and creating secret catholic societies?

Because religion is not filling the void in the human spirit like it promises to do. 

In radical Islam, the void also showed up in 9/11.  In Israel, the void shows up with next week’s suicide bomber.  I say it needs to stop. 

Such desperate measures taken in pursuit of closure! 

Noggin

If I may, without “spamming” this miniature world which is out of my jurisdiction, the idea of self sacrafice should not be taken literally. To do so injures the parts of the body and mind that are necessary to live past sacrafice… It is best not to handi-cap yourself “in the name of ‘God’” but to sacrafice for those who need it… such as a person in need of aid (ie: blood doner, charities of food, etc…). This is how a lesser “diety” sees this issue, that and dad has always said “why do they ALWAYS bleed for me? I can do so quite well on my own!”

“When I see a religious fanatic, I smile and just assume it’s best not to tell them I’ve come ‘back’ again”

-Jesus

[quote author=“calmooney”]The whole self-mortification thing could almost be funny were it not for the influence Opus Dei wields. The secretary of state for education over here in the UK is a member…

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/4190115.stm

As long as you guys don’t let muslims in government, you should be OK.

I have been reading some of the testamonies of former numeraries at the link for ODAN I posted. Opus Dei has all the ear marks of a religious cult. They use mind control on their subjects and their every movement is watched and scrutinized.

Here’s a link to the methods Opus Dei uses to control their members. A former numerary has verified that she experienced these methods:

http://www.odan.org/tw_how_opus_dei_is_cult_like.htm#thought_control

Does anyone wonder if it would be worse than what we have now if a U S President were a member of Opus Dei? Think it can’t happen? Well, Senator Sam Brownback is running…..

Brownback is a dark horse but I see what you mean.

http://sites.pfaw.org/mtfolder/mt-search.cgi?search=Brownback&IncludeBlogs=3&Template=nfr

See the new movie about America’s worst spy FBI agent Robert Hanssen

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Hanssen

Guess what? He was a member of Opus Dei.