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The black holes
Posted: 11 April 2012 03:53 AM   [ Ignore ]  
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The black holes

Certainly, Scientists discovered a giant black hole at the center of our galaxy which is 4 million times double the sun, Qur’an had referred to these creatures, ...

Black holes are terrifying cosmic phenomenon and scientists are trying to discover its secrets and they found that these holes are in our galaxy and they are heavy four million times than the sun!

A group of germen scientists from Max Planck Society had found strong evidence that these holes are existed in our galaxy (Milky Way) and they accurately measured the space between earth and the center of the galaxy.

Before, it was just a kind of estimation because of the billions of stars but now it is a clear reality with no doubt.

For 16 years those scientists performed many studies on 28 stars around the center of Milky Way and by studying the movement of these starts they said that they became able to determine the characteristics of the substance that these stars are moving around.

Professor Reinhard Gentzl head of the research team said “our study offered a strong evidence on the existence of the giant black holes”

Astronomers accurately measured the space between earth and the center of the galaxy as they found it 27000 light years and they used infrared rays to penetrate the dust clouds

Did Quran pointed to these Black Holes?

Scientists say that these super-massive black holes are dead stars but they are very heavy within very narrow space, they are the cemetery of the stars, swallow, sweep everything coming close to it even light and they are swimming in the space.

As they have very enormous gravity they attract even light and do not reflect it and do not allow any light to leave, so, they are invisible.

Because of the greatness of these creatures, they are one of the very great cosmic phenomena.

Allah, Almighty swears by it (To show how great they are) and by their distinctive characteristics:

(Invisible, swims in the space, sweeps and swallows anything close to it even light).

Quran summed up these attributes in only three words. He almighty says:

“So, verily I swear of that invisibles * that running and sweep” At-Takweer (verses 15,16)

Since Allah, The Almighty swears by these frightful holes, it is a must that these should be discovered by human one day to be evidence of the sincerity of the Quran.

And this discovery must be on the hand of unbelievers to show them a proof for the sincerity of the Quran and to be as an argument on them on the Day of Resurrection.

And of course the appeal is addressed to non-Muslims, because Muslims believe in all that came in the Quran without physical evidence on this.

This means that the Quran text includes three clear miracles:

1. had preceded the Non-Muslims scientists in talking about the black holes phenomenon.

2. Pointed to an implication that these holes exist and will be discovered, as everything that Allah swears by it is necessary to be seen whether by human in this world or in the Hereafter to be a proof on the sincerity of the Quran.

3 - There is an implication that who will discover these holes are non-Muslim, and this is what actually happened, as the Scientists who discovered these holes are non-Muslims, and Allah talked to them as an answer to his swear:

“Verily this is the word of a most honorable Messenger” (At-Takweer-verse19)

Our question for those who denies these miracles: Do black holes have been described with such accuracy, accidentally? Or is there a scientific miracle in the Quran?

http://www.gweep.net/~jedi/pmwiki/pub/skins/monobook/black_hole_lores1280.jpg


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QWTnET4PXLg

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8WRQUyrN0pk&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8WRQUyrN0pk&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xD4AE16O2NU

 

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Posted: 11 April 2012 07:53 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 1 ]  
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Why don’t these translations from At-Takwir match? (14-17 given for each for clarity. From Wikipedia.)  These certainly don’t seem to match that of fady

15 ?????? ???????? ????????????
16 ?????????? ??????????

English Translation by Muhammad Shameem, Mohammad Wali Raazi and Muhammad Taqi Usmani:
[14] So, I swear by those (stars) that recede, [15] that proceed, that withdraw from the scene, [16] and by the night when it departs, [17] and the morning when it starts breathing,
English Translation by Mohammed Marmaduke Pickthall:
[14] Oh, but I call to witness the planets, [15] The stars which rise and set, [16] And the close of night, [17] And the breath of morning
English Translation by Yusuf Ali:
[14] So verily I call to witness the planets - that recede, [15] Go straight, or hide; [16] And the Night as it dissipates; [17] And the Dawn as it breathes away the darkness;-

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Posted: 11 April 2012 09:23 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 2 ]  
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Instead of cherry-picking verses to mis-translate that can then be twisted sufficiently out of shape for someone to say that it means something that it clearly does not, just to try and argue that there is scientific knowledge contained in these fairy tales, why don’t you simplify things by pointing out something in the koran that is a scientific discovery that hasn’t been made yet, but could be tested once you point the scientists in the right direction? A mathematical principle which is not yet known, something about microbial life or subatomic particles, anything would do. It would be nice, since the koran has this abundance of scientific knowledge, if you could point out the equations for quantum gravity. That would really help out a bunch.

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Posted: 11 April 2012 10:13 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 3 ]  
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    It was a little hard to tell which side of the pig you’re riding.  Huh?  OK.  I now understand you like the taste of bacon, at least on some things (if you eat meat at all).
    You’re right,  I wasn’t getting to the heart of it very fast. Fady really seemed full of it.  I genuinely didn’t know where he got his translations since Wikipedia had three that weren’t even close to his.  You know, the true believers claim you must read the Qu’ran (I prefer Koran, too) in the original Arabic in order to truly know what God meant when he passed his knowledge and enlightenment on to us through his messenger, Mo’.  So, maybe fady speaks Arabic and gets subtle nuances out of the verses that blasphemers like me and you can’t appreciate.  To me, in my ignorance, its the same as needing to read the Bible in the original Aramaic, Greek or Latin.  I like to compare the way all my favorite televangelists use the scriptures.  Have you noticed the way Jimmy S carries his Bible, holding one half and flipping the other half around at the congregation.  He really has a grasp on scripture. 
    I should be able to tell fady that he has a really poor grasp on reality, based on my observation that his translation is so odd and biased.  I’ll try harder—do better—next time.  Promise!
    Thanks for sharing.

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Posted: 12 April 2012 12:19 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 4 ]  
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BigRed91 - 11 April 2012 10:13 PM

    It was a little hard to tell which side of the pig you’re riding.  Huh?  OK.  I now understand you like the taste of bacon, at least on some things (if you eat meat at all).
    You’re right,  I wasn’t getting to the heart of it very fast. Fady really seemed full of it.  I genuinely didn’t know where he got his translations since Wikipedia had three that weren’t even close to his.  You know, the true believers claim you must read the Qu’ran (I prefer Koran, too) in the original Arabic in order to truly know what God meant when he passed his knowledge and enlightenment on to us through his messenger, Mo’.  So, maybe fady speaks Arabic and gets subtle nuances out of the verses that blasphemers like me and you can’t appreciate.  To me, in my ignorance, its the same as needing to read the Bible in the original Aramaic, Greek or Latin.  I like to compare the way all my favorite televangelists use the scriptures.  Have you noticed the way Jimmy S carries his Bible, holding one half and flipping the other half around at the congregation.  He really has a grasp on scripture. 
    I should be able to tell fady that he has a really poor grasp on reality, based on my observation that his translation is so odd and biased.  I’ll try harder—do better—next time.  Promise!
    Thanks for sharing.

After re-reading my first post, I can see how you might have thought that it was directed at you. Let me assure you that it was not. I was talking to the original poster. It is, sadly, quite common for the religious cockroaches to come out of the woodwork every time a discovery is made, telling us all about how the bronze age savages that wrote their core texts foresaw this discovery and wrote about it. My point was merely for them to stop showing me the last scientific discovery and start showing me the next one before the discovery is made. Then they can say that their books have something to contribute to science. Until they can point out scientific facts that haven’t been discovered yet, I will do all that I can to bring facets of their intellect and character to light that they probably would prefer remained unexamined.

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Posted: 12 April 2012 06:23 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 5 ]  
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BigRed91 - 11 April 2012 07:53 AM

Why don’t these translations from At-Takwir match? (14-17 given for each for clarity. From Wikipedia.)  These certainly don’t seem to match that of fady

15 ?????? ???????? ????????????
16 ?????????? ??????????

English Translation by Muhammad Shameem, Mohammad Wali Raazi and Muhammad Taqi Usmani:
[14] So, I swear by those (stars) that recede, [15] that proceed, that withdraw from the scene, [16] and by the night when it departs, [17] and the morning when it starts breathing,
English Translation by Mohammed Marmaduke Pickthall:
[14] Oh, but I call to witness the planets, [15] The stars which rise and set, [16] And the close of night, [17] And the breath of morning
English Translation by Yusuf Ali:
[14] So verily I call to witness the planets - that recede, [15] Go straight, or hide; [16] And the Night as it dissipates; [17] And the Dawn as it breathes away the darkness;-

 

 

In this
Quran
  Of
1433 year

We offer this
To the world
The theories
To discover
People
Non-Muslims
  The truth
God says
In the Holy Quran In this
Quran
(53) We will show them Our signs in the horizons and within themselves until it becomes clear to them that it is the truth. But is it not sufficient concerning your Lord that He is, over all things, a Witness

 

 

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Posted: 12 April 2012 06:36 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 6 ]  
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VeronicaS - 12 April 2012 12:19 AM
BigRed91 - 11 April 2012 10:13 PM

    It was a little hard to tell which side of the pig you’re riding.  Huh?  OK.  I now understand you like the taste of bacon, at least on some things (if you eat meat at all).
    You’re right,  I wasn’t getting to the heart of it very fast. Fady really seemed full of it.  I genuinely didn’t know where he got his translations since Wikipedia had three that weren’t even close to his.  You know, the true believers claim you must read the Qu’ran (I prefer Koran, too) in the original Arabic in order to truly know what God meant when he passed his knowledge and enlightenment on to us through his messenger, Mo’.  So, maybe fady speaks Arabic and gets subtle nuances out of the verses that blasphemers like me and you can’t appreciate.  To me, in my ignorance, its the same as needing to read the Bible in the original Aramaic, Greek or Latin.  I like to compare the way all my favorite televangelists use the scriptures.  Have you noticed the way Jimmy S carries his Bible, holding one half and flipping the other half around at the congregation.  He really has a grasp on scripture. 
    I should be able to tell fady that he has a really poor grasp on reality, based on my observation that his translation is so odd and biased.  I’ll try harder—do better—next time.  Promise!
    Thanks for sharing.

After re-reading my first post, I can see how you might have thought that it was directed at you. Let me assure you that it was not. I was talking to the original poster. It is, sadly, quite common for the religious cockroaches to come out of the woodwork every time a discovery is made, telling us all about how the bronze age savages that wrote their core texts foresaw this discovery and wrote about it. My point was merely for them to stop showing me the last scientific discovery and start showing me the next one before the discovery is made. Then they can say that their books have something to contribute to science. Until they can point out scientific facts that haven’t been discovered yet, I will do all that I can to bring facets of their intellect and character to light that they probably would prefer remained unexamined.

The truth here

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CDjd23CDEtA

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GtJYdAaP6xg

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A3yWd046SeY


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kM8FQJpULvA

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g6gD-yYmMv4

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=445QbsqoF4A

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Posted: 12 April 2012 09:26 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 7 ]  
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To VeronicaS, well said!  Very clearly, concisely written.  Thanks.
To fady, get a life.  I am working on a personally new topic that the entire Muslim world is dumbed down—kept in their ignorance—because of what the Koran says and how your imams choose to interpret it for you and on you.  They want you to read so you can read the Koran, not so you can read other books.  It’s no wonder.  It’s how Islam has brainwashed a billion peasants.  It’s why most of the desert Muslim world still looks like a poor Mexican pueblo (or Disneyland if you consider Dubai City).  That’s how your clergy protect their rice bowls—stay in business.  You know what you’ve been taught, that the only safe place on Earth is in a mosque—the only safe place evil can’t touch you.  Well, I’m here to witness to you, inspired by your God, Allah if you like, that the only safe place in the Universe is possibly in our own minds.  It’s only ‘possible’ because we have to have a lot of luck in our lives in order to have a mind that can build a safe place.  Second, as everyone grows up they have to create their own safe place from among all the unsafe places they encounter.  They usually have to try hard and have to have will and a purpose because most aren’t lucky enough to do without working on it.  Many are lost for ever, lost to their family and friends, never to the know Earth’s beauty again.  It is really easy to be unlucky.  For example, fady, I once did drugs.  I won’t say what kind or how long.  Use your imagination.  This was a very unsafe place for my mind.  I was brain washed for a while and then, with a lot of luck and perseverance, got all the crap cleaned out and did some some really beautiful and useful things.  I’m not done yet.  Your young Islamist head is wandering around the halls of Sam Harris.org.  I think this is a long way from Damascus, for any guy like you.  I’m sure we are on subjectively different planets.  Mine is called Earth.  It is a 4.6 billion year-old world, covered mostly of water, with billions of living beings that all try to eek out a living in their own modest niche.  Why don’t you join me? But, . . .
Do not,
young one,
try splash
the weird Allah
rest of
us on.
    I say, “Chuck the duck!”

[ Edited: 12 April 2012 10:39 AM by BigRed91]
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Posted: 12 April 2012 08:59 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 8 ]  
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fady - 12 April 2012 06:36 AM

The truth here

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CDjd23CDEtA

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GtJYdAaP6xg

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A3yWd046SeY


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kM8FQJpULvA

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g6gD-yYmMv4

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=445QbsqoF4A

Was one of those videos about how mohamed was crazy, enjoyed raping small children of both sexes, and the world would be a much safer, happier place if he had never been born? If yes, then you are correct in saying ‘The truth here’.

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Posted: 13 April 2012 07:43 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 9 ]  
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Prophet Mohammad Aisha marriage story

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vepT50JxMEQ

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Posted: 13 April 2012 02:55 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 10 ]  
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Is this the point at which I’m supposed to run down to a military surplus store and buy myself a duffle bag to climb into? Possibly stash some nice rocks in there to kill a few of my friends with?  No number of crazy videos about your crazy prophet, your crazy religion or your crazy god will be sufficient to persuade me that islam is anything other than a disgustingly evil organization, and, frankly, I’m a little confused on the point of what it is, exactly, that you hope to accomplish by posting them, unless you are trying to figure out what it is about your bronze age superstitions that civilized people find objectionable. If that is the case, then, I would be happy to explain this to you.

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Posted: 15 April 2012 03:53 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 11 ]  
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xD4AE16O2NU

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Posted: 24 April 2012 09:51 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 12 ]  
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... is it so wrong to search for solutions in unlikely places???
... is fady hurting anyone that he must be attacked???
... he shared a bit of info, a bit about his beliefs and that makes him a cockroach???

... is it our lack of free will that makes us lash out at those who disagree with us???

is the website of an atheist off limits to a Christian/Muslim???  if so, why???

I am surprised that an Atheist would react so intensely hostile , I’d expect that more from a religious zealot…

BTW I am a Christian and I love challenges and I love and value others’ opinions and their lack of Free Will to
believe or not to believe

at least there is some guise of “freedom” in America!  Amen to that and Thank You Lord,

now pass the Pork Chops, no bacon here!

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Posted: 24 April 2012 11:08 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 13 ]  
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I have not attacked him. He has not shared any ‘info’, what he has done is, as I said earlier, try to take retroactive credit for the scientific discovery of black holes. If that ridiculous collection of fairy tales and barbarism called the koran had anything in it about black holes, why is it that muslims weren’t describing their properties and characteristics in the 18th century? The only reason that my responses sounded like ‘intense hostility’ to you was that you have the unquestioned assumption that religious beliefs are above question or criticism. Just so you know, for future reference, they are not. If you come in here with something as stupid as trying to assert that muslims knew about black holes, your ideas will have to hold up under examination. You say that you love and value the opinions of others. Does that also apply to fady’s opinion about how it is right, proper and ordained by god that the age of consent should be the age of seven years old? You might want to have a look at some of those crazy ideas in the videos he posted the links to before displaying the knee-jerk reaction of jumping to their defense. I understand that you have this aversion to calling one of the abrahamic religions into question, since it is difficult to criticise one without undermining all three, but, in this particular instance, the best thing to do is sit down, shut up, and consider what it is, exactly, that you are trying to jump in to defend.

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Posted: 24 April 2012 03:34 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 14 ]  
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Now, now.  Calm down everyone.  Fady is just a devout Muslim.  It his his duty to convert all to Islam. His first post was full of holes, some totally dark.  Ms Butterfly, like me, has probably had her wits stepped on a few times by religionists, most likely of the Abrahamist variety.  Veronica, you seem pretty touchy.  Dawn is right about that.  Dawn seems self-assured, but I’m not sure she is a true Christian.  Her Christianity seems more convenience than conviction.  Dawn seems more like a Christian who doesn’t want to challenge the status quo.  That’s the deal.  People who accept the supernatural aren’t really bothered that there is no evidence.  They’ve been brainwashed from birth and their friends and family would cause them endless grief if they showed too much doubt.  Believing is easy and has tangible rewards.  Religionists not only don’t want to NOT believe, they can’t NOT believe.  If Dawn says she believes in god then she doesn’t have to prove anything to anyone, because in all likelihood she is surrounded by and supported by her own kind.  There is no need to deny what she hasn’t seen, touched and felt.  No one has and most of them are believers.  So, she doesn’t even try.  Veronica, bless her, does try.  She’s refuses to believe what has no evidence.  It’s the same for Fady of the wady.  All atheists and agnostics are looking diligently.  We are watching everyone.  What scientists and engineers say is most compelling.  But we even pay attention to what religionists say and what they claim to believe in.  For example, I’ve been a student of tel-evangelists for many years.  Some of my favorites are Herbert W. Armstrong of the WORLD WIDE CHURCH OF GOD, Robert ‘muggabugga’ Tilton, and Elizabeth Prophet who profited from the godhead.  But, I’ve come to understand that they all believe the same thing.  And, I’ve come to believe the exact opposite.  It’s all about the supernatural vs. observable, testable science.  Fady is trying to tie science to his holy book.  That’s only natural.  Cut it out Fady, it doesn’t work like that.  Mohammed was just a man who imagined—dreamed up—an encounter with the supposed omnipotent creator of the universe.  He didn’t really talk to allah or god or jehovah.  He just said he did.  It was his gimmick.  What he really did do was come up with a way to capture the imagination of enough people to start a 1400 year old religion.  Jesus did the same thing.  Science has nothing to do with Islam or Christianity, except in their actual, physical history.  Successful religion works because there is a lot of luck and a lot of work, but not by divine intervention—at all.  In that light, it is the followers of Jesus bear more scrutiny because it was they who carried Christianity into the next two millennia.  So, everyone just chill.  Fady, all you have to do to change—to get nearer to the truth—is just accept that at least one precept of the Koran is not perfect.  It should then all implode for you, like a house of cards.  Dawn, just show me one miracle.  I would prefer a rabbit fossil in Cambrian rock strata.  But, I’ll watch water turn into wine or whatever you’ve got.  It’s got to be good science though.  For Veronica, we shouldn’t get too worked up.  Just think it up!  Taunting them should at least be fun, because it’s almost unavoidable.

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Posted: 24 April 2012 04:30 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 15 ]  
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I just find it more pleasant when people can have a difference of opinion without attacking one another.  Now if Fady has an IQ of 90 would you be more forgiving of his post??? As Sam Harris argues, Fady has no choice, so maybe we should avoid be overly critical of one another based on that supposed fact???  Notice I pose these as questions, I am here to learn and share.  What kind of Christian I am should not matter unless I make it an issue, judge not lest ye be judged (forget that is biblical and just consider it words to the wise).  BTW, I was not raised to be a Christian, nor encoraged to do so, nor am I a church goer… I pray in private and have no need to flock to/with others based on their beliefs.  I have more Atheists in my family than Christians, how’s that???  I love to read anything relating to religion and thirst for knowledge of the early days of Christianity as well as other religions, I feel that mankind has this need as a survival mechanism and all the warring over religion could be a form of population control and/or gene selection / natural selection.  One isssue I have with Christianity is that eventually eugenics will have to be considered, it has already been tested in several societies it will actually be a humane action but not one that the hard headed religious right will consider.

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