No Sinners
Posted: 31 August 2012 10:25 PM   [ Ignore ]  
Newbie
Rank
Total Posts:  10
Joined  2012-08-28

  In Buddhism, actions are merely termed as unskillful or unwholesome, not as sinful.

Buddhists do not regard man as sinful by nature of ‘in rebellion against god’. Every human being is a person of great worth who has within himself a vast store of good as well as evil habits. The good in a person is always waiting for a suitable opportunity to flower and to ripen. Remember the saying, ‘There is so much that is good in the worst of us and so much that is bad in the best of us.’ Buddhism teaches that everyone is responsible for his own good and bad deeds, and that each individual can mould his own destiny. Says the Buddha, ‘These evil deeds were only done by you, not by your parents, friends, or relatives; and you yourself will reap the painful results.’ (Dhammapada 165)

Man’s sorrow is his own making and is not handed down by a family curse or an original sin of a mythical primeval ancestor. Buddhists do not accept the belief that this world is merely a place of trial and testing. This world can be made a place where we can attain the highest perfection. And perfection is synonymous with happiness. To the Buddha, man is not an experiment in life created by somebody which can be done away with when unwanted. If a sin could be forgiven, people might take advantage and commit more and more sins. The Buddhist has no reason to believe that the sinner can escape the consequences by the grace of an external power. If a man thrusts his hand into a furnace, his hand will be burnt, and all the prayer in the world will not remove the scars. The same is with the man who walks into the fires of evil action. The Buddha’s approach to the problems of suffering is not imaginary, speculative or metaphysical, but essentially empirical. According to Buddhism, there is no such thing as sin as explained by other religions. To the Buddhists, sin is unskillful or unwholesome action - Akusala Kamma, which creates Papa - the downfall of man. The wicked man is an ignorant man. He needs instruction more than he needs punishment and condemnation. He is not regarded as violating god’s will or as a person who must beg for divine mercy and forgiveness. He needs only guidance for his enlightenment. All that is necessary is for someone to help him use his reason to realize that he is responsible for his wrong action and that he must pay for the consequences. Therefore the belief in confession is foreign to Buddhism.

The purpose of the Buddha’s appearance in this world is not to wash away the sins committed by human beings nor to punish or to destroy the wicked people, but to make the people understand how foolish it is to commit evil and to point out the reaction of such evil deeds. Consequently there are no commandments in Buddhism, since no one can command another for his spiritual upliftment. The Buddha has encouraged us to develop and use our understanding. He has shown us the path for our liberation from suffering. The precepts that we undertake to observe are not commandments: they are observed voluntarily. The Buddha’s Teaching is thus: ‘Please pay attention; take this advice and think it over. If you think it is suitable for you to practise my advice, then try to practise it. You can see the results through your own experience.’ There is no religious value in blindly observing any commandment without proper conviction and understanding. However, we should not take advantage of the liberty given by the Buddha to do anything we like. It is our duty to behave as cultured, civilized and understanding human beings to lead a religious life. If we can understand this, commandments are not important. As an enlightened teacher, the Buddha advised us on how to lead a pure life without imposing commandments and using the fear of punishment.

Profile
 
 
Posted: 01 September 2012 10:55 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 1 ]  
Member
Avatar
RankRankRank
Total Posts:  800
Joined  2010-11-12
Humphrey W.J - 31 August 2012 10:25 PM

  In Buddhism, actions are merely termed as unskillful or unwholesome, not as sinful.

Buddhists do not regard man as sinful by nature of ‘in rebellion against god’. Every human being is a person of great worth who has within himself a vast store of good as well as evil habits. The good in a person is always waiting for a suitable opportunity to flower and to ripen. Remember the saying, ‘There is so much that is good in the worst of us and so much that is bad in the best of us.’ Buddhism teaches that everyone is responsible for his own good and bad deeds, and that each individual can mould his own destiny. Says the Buddha, ‘These evil deeds were only done by you, not by your parents, friends, or relatives; and you yourself will reap the painful results.’ (Dhammapada 165)

Man’s sorrow is his own making and is not handed down by a family curse or an original sin of a mythical primeval ancestor. Buddhists do not accept the belief that this world is merely a place of trial and testing. This world can be made a place where we can attain the highest perfection. And perfection is synonymous with happiness. To the Buddha, man is not an experiment in life created by somebody which can be done away with when unwanted. If a sin could be forgiven, people might take advantage and commit more and more sins. The Buddhist has no reason to believe that the sinner can escape the consequences by the grace of an external power. If a man thrusts his hand into a furnace, his hand will be burnt, and all the prayer in the world will not remove the scars. The same is with the man who walks into the fires of evil action. The Buddha’s approach to the problems of suffering is not imaginary, speculative or metaphysical, but essentially empirical. According to Buddhism, there is no such thing as sin as explained by other religions. To the Buddhists, sin is unskillful or unwholesome action - Akusala Kamma, which creates Papa - the downfall of man. The wicked man is an ignorant man. He needs instruction more than he needs punishment and condemnation. He is not regarded as violating god’s will or as a person who must beg for divine mercy and forgiveness. He needs only guidance for his enlightenment. All that is necessary is for someone to help him use his reason to realize that he is responsible for his wrong action and that he must pay for the consequences. Therefore the belief in confession is foreign to Buddhism.

The purpose of the Buddha’s appearance in this world is not to wash away the sins committed by human beings nor to punish or to destroy the wicked people, but to make the people understand how foolish it is to commit evil and to point out the reaction of such evil deeds. Consequently there are no commandments in Buddhism, since no one can command another for his spiritual upliftment. The Buddha has encouraged us to develop and use our understanding. He has shown us the path for our liberation from suffering. The precepts that we undertake to observe are not commandments: they are observed voluntarily. The Buddha’s Teaching is thus: ‘Please pay attention; take this advice and think it over. If you think it is suitable for you to practise my advice, then try to practise it. You can see the results through your own experience.’ There is no religious value in blindly observing any commandment without proper conviction and understanding. However, we should not take advantage of the liberty given by the Buddha to do anything we like. It is our duty to behave as cultured, civilized and understanding human beings to lead a religious life. If we can understand this, commandments are not important. As an enlightened teacher, the Buddha advised us on how to lead a pure life without imposing commandments and using the fear of punishment.

 

The Buddha. like all teachers, fell into the trap of believing the self was an actual entity.
He then prescribed a set of suggestion that would hopefully make the self’s dream of separation a little easier.
Human minds are always seeking a way to relieve fear and assuage the tension of simply being a part of life.
In a way all that hokus-pokus works…....for a while.
The mind can calm itself…....for a while.
It can even trick itself into believing that its world is getting better…...for a while.
But it’s all a shell game.
There is another way that does not have anything to do with shining a brick or stacking shadows.

 

 

 

Profile
 
 
Posted: 13 September 2012 09:02 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 2 ]  
Jr. Member
RankRank
Total Posts:  51
Joined  2009-06-26

I love buddhism. I do think it is some of the best “wisdom” human beings can/have aspired to.

I currently have a married friend who is having marriage difficulties and an older married doctor is pursuing her. She is just a conquest for him, but she is flattered by his attention and is having a real hard time staying away from him. I liken it as a moth to a flame.

Profile
 
 
Posted: 13 September 2012 10:57 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 3 ]  
Member
Avatar
RankRankRank
Total Posts:  800
Joined  2010-11-12
Majority of One - 13 September 2012 09:02 PM

I love buddhism. I do think it is some of the best “wisdom” human beings can/have aspired to.

I currently have a married friend who is having marriage difficulties and an older married doctor is pursuing her. She is just a conquest for him, but she is flattered by his attention and is having a real hard time staying away from him. I liken it as a moth to a flame.

If one must have a magical map to chart a course through the conceptual overlay,  I would imagine that Buddhism is far better than Scientology.

[ Edited: 14 September 2012 05:49 PM by toombaru]
Profile
 
 
Posted: 14 September 2012 07:11 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 4 ]  
Jr. Member
RankRank
Total Posts:  51
Joined  2009-06-26

I don’t see buddhism as “magical” but maybe I’m missing something. I think it is finding a way to have discipline. That’s where I was going with my example of the married friend. It is a way to work on issues where we want something like attention from the opposite sex even though that is an illusion of self worth at best, and see your way out of it when that is the hardest thing to do.

Everyone seems to think their situation is different, so all the advice from others who have “been there” gets discounted. If you follow a discipline such as buddhism, it can help you see that you truly are no different, that your situation isn’t different and it will end the same for you as it has for everyone else. Giving up “attachments” has helped me and I credit buddhist teaching for that help.

Scientology is based on “dianetics” or some such thing. It is a discipline as well I suppose, but it doesn’t have quite the same impact in practice as buddhism.

Profile
 
 
Posted: 14 September 2012 07:25 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 5 ]  
Member
Avatar
RankRankRank
Total Posts:  800
Joined  2010-11-12
Majority of One - 14 September 2012 07:11 PM

I don’t see buddhism as “magical” but maybe I’m missing something. I think it is finding a way to have discipline. That’s where I was going with my example of the married friend. It is a way to work on issues where we want something like attention from the opposite sex even though that is an illusion of self worth at best, and see your way out of it when that is the hardest thing to do.

Everyone seems to think their situation is different, so all the advice from others who have “been there” gets discounted. If you follow a discipline such as buddhism, it can help you see that you truly are no different, that your situation isn’t different and it will end the same for you as it has for everyone else. Giving up “attachments” has helped me and I credit buddhist teaching for that help.

Scientology is based on “dianetics” or some such thing. It is a discipline as well I suppose, but it doesn’t have quite the same impact in practice as buddhism.


Are you attached to Buddhism?

Profile
 
 
Posted: 14 September 2012 08:04 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 6 ]  
Member
Avatar
RankRankRank
Total Posts:  800
Joined  2010-11-12
toombaru - 14 September 2012 07:25 PM
Majority of One - 14 September 2012 07:11 PM

I don’t see buddhism as “magical” but maybe I’m missing something. I think it is finding a way to have discipline. That’s where I was going with my example of the married friend. It is a way to work on issues where we want something like attention from the opposite sex even though that is an illusion of self worth at best, and see your way out of it when that is the hardest thing to do.

Everyone seems to think their situation is different, so all the advice from others who have “been there” gets discounted. If you follow a discipline such as buddhism, it can help you see that you truly are no different, that your situation isn’t different and it will end the same for you as it has for everyone else. Giving up “attachments” has helped me and I credit buddhist teaching for that help.

Scientology is based on “dianetics” or some such thing. It is a discipline as well I suppose, but it doesn’t have quite the same impact in practice as buddhism.


Are you attached to Buddhism?


Any plan that conceptual mind develops to soothe its psychological self is inherently flawed.
Only a mind would come up with the idea that it can discipline itself.
The self is a fiction.
And its attempts to modify a hundred million years of evolutionary behavior would be laughable if they weren’t so painfully constricting.
Do you think you can control what is happening in the frontal cortex?
You can’t.
And any school of thought that wants the mind to be in charge of the mind is delusional.
Try to get the mind not to think about purple snakes for just one hour and watch what happens.

Profile
 
 
Posted: 14 September 2012 11:25 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 7 ]  
Jr. Member
RankRank
Total Posts:  51
Joined  2009-06-26

I agree and no, I’m not attached to buddhism. I don’t really get attached to anything, which I sometimes think is a flaw.

I’m just talking about the illusion of discipline and the illusion of control. It does help sometimes to stop and ask yourself “why am I behaving this way and what do I expect as a result” and sometimes doing something stupid can be nipped in the bud. Didn’t say it was a perfect system. Sometimes just having the illusion of control is comforting to this blonde blue-eyed monkey.

Profile
 
 
Posted: 15 September 2012 07:43 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 8 ]  
Member
Avatar
RankRankRank
Total Posts:  800
Joined  2010-11-12
Majority of One - 14 September 2012 11:25 PM

I agree and no, I’m not attached to buddhism. I don’t really get attached to anything, which I sometimes think is a flaw.

I’m just talking about the illusion of discipline and the illusion of control. It does help sometimes to stop and ask yourself “why am I behaving this way and what do I expect as a result” and sometimes doing something stupid can be nipped in the bud. Didn’t say it was a perfect system. Sometimes just having the illusion of control is comforting to this blonde blue-eyed monkey.


You are attached to non-attachment.
The mind IS attachment.
The mind will continue the attempt to manipulate itself until it doesn’t.
Like all organic life, it changes over time to adapt in a world of changing circumstances.
Sometimes it appears to change because of it own efforts.
But that is not what is happening at all.
The brain is survival oriented and will evaluate the circumstances the best it can and make suggestions to its-self.
The self is the imaginary psychological center of all this activity.
It will attempt to follow the orders sent from the brain….........not always to perfection.
The illusion of control is the illusion of control.
Life is scary but driving drunk has a downside.

 

Profile
 
 
Posted: 15 September 2012 11:36 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 9 ]  
Jr. Member
RankRank
Total Posts:  51
Joined  2009-06-26

How am I driving drunk?

If I’m attached to non-attachment then I can’t really win can I? If I become unattached to non-attachment then I’m attached to being unattached to non-attachment and it becomes turtles all the way down. Why can’t I recognize that my brain is hard to control but using some sort of discipline like dianetics or buddhism or Bob’s system, can help me reign in my attachment to the drama that is other people?

If this brings me some sort of happiness then what is it to you? You should be happy for me that I’m at least trying. I like what you said, but I don’t understand how I can stop driving drunk as you say and try to just BE without wanting some sort of control even if it is an illusion.

Profile
 
 
Posted: 15 September 2012 12:26 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 10 ]  
Member
Avatar
RankRankRank
Total Posts:  800
Joined  2010-11-12
Majority of One - 15 September 2012 11:36 AM

How am I driving drunk?

If I’m attached to non-attachment then I can’t really win can I? If I become unattached to non-attachment then I’m attached to being unattached to non-attachment and it becomes turtles all the way down. Why can’t I recognize that my brain is hard to control but using some sort of discipline like dianetics or buddhism or Bob’s system, can help me reign in my attachment to the drama that is other people?

If this brings me some sort of happiness then what is it to you? You should be happy for me that I’m at least trying. I like what you said, but I don’t understand how I can stop driving drunk as you say and try to just BE without wanting some sort of control even if it is an illusion.

I relate to your struggle.
I really do.
I was on the front lines for fifty years.
I never won a battle.
I never gained an inch of ground.
I never planted a single flag.
I never even found a field to plant it in.
You are stacking shadows and chasing the horizon.
You cannot win.
The cards are stacked.
There is nothing you can do.
You cannot answer questions about things that exist only as ideas.
You cannot polish a make belief stone.
Any attempt to escape a conceptual prison only adds brick and mortar to the walls.
The sense of being a you emerges downstream from the brain’s activity.
The personal identity did not evolve to be happy.
Its function is to look for happiness. (those things that fulfill its desires and help it survive and reproduce).
You will continue the search until you don’t.
Do you know any human that has attained peace of mind?
Do you know what enlightenment is?
Can you actually define what you seek?
Don’t you imagine that if there were something to find in the mind’s shadowland that someone would have found it by now?

 

[ Edited: 15 September 2012 01:03 PM by toombaru]
Profile
 
 
Posted: 15 September 2012 09:23 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 11 ]  
Jr. Member
RankRank
Total Posts:  51
Joined  2009-06-26

You are talking about enlightment, happiness, etc as being permanent.

I’m talking about them being moments…here and there.

I know I cannot achieve happiness as a permanent state. But, if I can grab a piece here, a slice there, isn’t it worth the struggle?

Also, even if no one else on the planet has found it, why can’t I be the first? I am majority of ONE after all.

Using once again your metaphor of driving drunk>>> one can"t be drunk all the time

Profile
 
 
Posted: 15 September 2012 10:39 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 12 ]  
Member
Avatar
RankRankRank
Total Posts:  800
Joined  2010-11-12
Majority of One - 15 September 2012 09:23 PM

You are talking about enlightment, happiness, etc as being permanent.

I’m talking about them being moments…here and there.

I know I cannot achieve happiness as a permanent state. But, if I can grab a piece here, a slice there, isn’t it worth the struggle?

Also, even if no one else on the planet has found it, why can’t I be the first? I am majority of ONE after all.

Using once again your metaphor of driving drunk>>> one can"t be drunk all the time

 

I am not saying that happiness is unavailable.
I am saying that when the conceptual mind tries to force itself into an imaginary blueprint conceived by another mind, it is pursuing an impossible dream.
It can never attain something that exists only as an idea.
There is no such thing as enlightenment.
And anyone who claims to have attained it is a charleton.
There is no such thing as peace of mind.
A peaceful mind is like a still wind.
There is, however, a natural happiness that does not involve contorting and twisting the mind into something was never designed to be.
In all sentient beings there exists an easy, spontaneous, uncontrolled happiness.
Watch dogs at the beach, babies when they first meet, dolphins on the bow of a sailboat.
There is great joy in simply being awareness itself flowing along in the great unknown-unknowable.
You will never be able to find happiness.
It is who you are.

Profile
 
 
Posted: 15 September 2012 11:14 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 13 ]  
Jr. Member
RankRank
Total Posts:  51
Joined  2009-06-26

I am writing a novel and when the words come, and I read back over what I’ve written and I think I WROTE THAT, I have some moments of extreme joy and happiness. Does it last? No. But, I do have those moments. It is who I am.

Profile
 
 
Posted: 15 September 2012 11:21 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 14 ]  
Member
Avatar
RankRankRank
Total Posts:  800
Joined  2010-11-12
Majority of One - 15 September 2012 11:14 PM

I am writing a novel and when the words come, and I read back over what I’ve written and I think I WROTE THAT, I have some moments of extreme joy and happiness. Does it last? No. But, I do have those moments. It is who I am.

Permanent happiness would be a strange hell.
To be aware that one is happy is one of the great joys of life.
It is unique to humans.

Profile
 
 
   
 
 
RSS 2.0     Atom Feed