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My Brain Hurts
Posted: 05 February 2006 04:44 AM   [ Ignore ]  
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Hello to all.  I'm new posting on this site.  I just finished "The End of Faith" last night.  And my brain hurts.  I understand most of Mr. Harris is saying and agree with most of it as well.  It makes sense to me.  Reasoning.  Right?  I was a literalist Christian most of my life and have recently (withing the last two years) "lost" my faith and began to look at the world outside the Bible.  And I am happy for this, except that how do we not let all of this information and thinking overwhlem us?  How do we continue to live daily with all of this information and reasoning in our heads.  Perhaps I am becoming overwhlemed because this is all so very new to me.  Either way, any suggestions on how to approach life with this new understanding and reason without going crazy or wearing myself out thinking?

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Posted: 05 February 2006 04:55 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 1 ]  
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Welcome!  I know what you mean.  What worked for me was just taking it one-day-at-a-time.

Pete

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http://powerlessnolonger.com

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Posted: 09 February 2006 11:25 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 2 ]  
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Just remember that it took people thousands of years to develop the framework you left behind.  Changing platforms can be overwhelming.  Don’t despair.  Your new views will make more sense as you develop them over time.  Just remember to steer clear of nonsense.

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Posted: 09 February 2006 12:02 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 3 ]  
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[quote author=“kpossible76”]I was a literalist Christian most of my life and have recently (withing the last two years) “lost” my faith and began to look at the world outside the Bible.

Yea, rather, blessed are they that hear the word of God, and keep it. Luke 11:28

Kpossible, time to get back into the faith?

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Come to me, all you who are weary and burdened, and I will give you rest. Take my yoke upon you and learn from me, for I am gentle and humble in heart, and you will find rest for your souls. For my yoke is easy and my burden is light. Matt 11:28-29

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Posted: 09 February 2006 02:41 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 4 ]  
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Hi kpossible. I would start by talking about the things which are not comfortable about your former beliefs when held up to the light of reason. People here will help you do that.
Do the thing you fear, and the death of fear is certain.
You’ll soon discover that the depth of the lie is staggering. My advice is to stay calm and don’t become angered over it. Instead, reason away. Read all you can handle:
Start with Bertrand Russell Why I am Not A Christian Just google it to find it.
Anything by Richard Dawkins or Carl Sagan is pretty comforting as well. Peace.

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Posted: 09 February 2006 05:06 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 5 ]  
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[quote author=“monkeyman666”]Hi kpossible. I would start by talking about the things which are not comfortable about your former beliefs when held up to the light of reason. People here will help you do that.
Do the thing you fear, and the death of fear is certain.
You’ll soon discover that the depth of the lie is staggering. My advice is to stay calm and don’t become angered over it. Instead, reason away. Read all you can handle:
Start with Bertrand Russell Why I am Not A Christian Just google it to find it.
Anything by Richard Dawkins or Carl Sagan is pretty comforting as well. Peace.

kpossible, in a morally proper world, apostate counseling would get so much funding that anti-superstition think-tanks would thrive and publish books and periodicals constantly. That’s how important and ignored your problem is. But as you well know, we instead live in a fairlytale world of pretending that things are other than what they actually are.

Unfortunately I have no general advice, but I’m fairly certain that if you provide us with some specific details about thoughts that might be plaguing you, you’ll get support and reality therapy from several ex-pate thinkers such as psiconoclast. I’ll do what I can as well, as I deal with certain unfortunate reverberations daily and I’ve been off the G-drug for more than a decade now.

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Philosophy may in no way interfere with the actual use of language; it can in the end only describe it. For it cannot give it any foundations either. It leaves everything as it is.
Ludwig Wittgenstein

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Posted: 11 February 2006 02:14 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 6 ]  
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Thank you to everybody who has responded to this post.  I really appreciate the support.  What I have found as a challenge this week is istening to my Dad talk about the Sunday School class he is starting this weekend.  It’s about community, nad is a good topic.  But it’s just the whole church thing all together.  The thing is, I know exactly how he thinks and feels.  And I won’t argue with him, because I know exactly what he will say.  How in the owrld do you approach this subject with someone who love who is laready very hurt b/c you have walked away from their faith?

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Posted: 12 February 2006 12:12 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 7 ]  
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I know this might meet with some resistance, but I have lived my life quite happily by understanding very early on that:

Nothing anybody does or says is because of you.

If he is “hurt” by your walking away from the church, it only serves as another example (sorry for you confronting this) of how ingrained the “control” mechanisms are from christianity. Here is what I can promise you: He is only “hurt” as long as it takes him to figure out that there is NO RETURN. (His being hurt will not influence your return to the church) Once he gets that piece of information firmly in hand, his pain will turn to anger, it ALWAYS does.
Although I don’t necessarily agree with all of the book, try reading “The Four Agreements” by Don Miguel Ruiz. You may find it helpful.

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Posted: 12 February 2006 03:24 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 8 ]  
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[quote author=“kpossible76”]Thank you to everybody who has responded to this post.  I really appreciate the support.  What I have found as a challenge this week is istening to my Dad talk about the Sunday School class he is starting this weekend.  It’s about community, nad is a good topic.  But it’s just the whole church thing all together.  The thing is, I know exactly how he thinks and feels.  And I won’t argue with him, because I know exactly what he will say.  How in the owrld do you approach this subject with someone who love who is laready very hurt b/c you have walked away from their faith?

Hi Kpossible76, poor thing, what a conundrum you find yourself in. I believe you did not “walk away” from the faith, you never were a Christian in the first place. If you had, you would never walk away because to do so would mean that you accept God’s wrath, which is to come in due time. It is appointed unto all men to die, after this, the judgement. Your primary motivation to become a Christian would be to escape the wrath to come, the eternal separation from God. Nobody would know this, then walk away from it. But a person who had some other motivation to become a Christian, not concerned with the law and its penalty, but wanting the fruits that come with being a Christian; this type can easily fall away.

The whole purpose of the law and the reason it was introduced to mankind was to show man that his heart is dark, that he loves sin and transgression, and the even if he tries to be good, he is not. The law makes man aware that he is a sinner, lost, and headed toward hell. But God has a way of escape. I know its seems miraculous, but God is in the miraculous business. Not only is Jesus Christ a way of escape from God’s wrath, but you some pretty good perks. But don’t expect them. Better count the cost. Better expect to suffer for Christ’s name. Expect loss and tribulation on this earth for even claiming to know Christ. But expect an eternity in his presence, and that is a lot to look forward to.

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Come to me, all you who are weary and burdened, and I will give you rest. Take my yoke upon you and learn from me, for I am gentle and humble in heart, and you will find rest for your souls. For my yoke is easy and my burden is light. Matt 11:28-29

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Posted: 12 February 2006 02:37 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 9 ]  
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Uh, yeah I was a Christian.  A very “strong” one at that.  I grew up in a non-demoinational bible preaching church and was very involved in the ministry there.  Then as I got older I moved a church that was a great church for me and was extremely involved in thier music ministry.  Here’s the thing…I know all your answers and all your ideas and beliefs b/c i used be in your shoes telling everybody that felt the way I do now what you are telling me.  There is no use arguing with you because until you open your mind and search for the truth you will continue to believe as you do now.  So i truly hope that someday you will look beyind what has been ingrained in your head and open up to recieve the truth.

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Posted: 12 February 2006 04:07 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 10 ]  
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[quote author=“kpossible76”]Uh, yeah I was a Christian.  A very “strong” one at that.  I grew up in a non-demoinational bible preaching church and was very involved in the ministry there.  Then as I got older I moved a church that was a great church for me and was extremely involved in thier music ministry.  Here’s the thing…I know all your answers and all your ideas and beliefs b/c i used be in your shoes telling everybody that felt the way I do now what you are telling me.  There is no use arguing with you because until you open your mind and search for the truth you will continue to believe as you do now.  So i truly hope that someday you will look beyind what has been ingrained in your head and open up to recieve the truth.

Sorry kpossible76, I don’t buy it. A strong Christian? A strong Christian is one who knows the law, the penalties thereof, and usually the sole motivation for accepting Christ is to escape the wrath that surely cometh. On the other hand, those who “put on Christ” and found humiliation and so forth, those who wanted to get in on the perks/gifts of the spirit, fruit of the spirit…those folks easily fall away. They were never convicted of sin by the law. Because, as you probably do not know, the bible says the law is perfect for converting the soul. That, my friend, is why real Christians should not go around spouting about how you will never find peace until you accept Christ. Nope, the law is perfect for converting the soul. How, by illuminating the concept of sin/transgression to the person, who then REPENTS (did you ever repent?) with Godly sorrow and accepts the grace and mercy of God through Christ.

kpossible76, you’re just too smart to have walked away in the face of sure eternal death. It would be logical to say that the concept would have made you hold onto Christ’s hand just a bit harder. Not because Jesus loves you…..(hey, is that even scriptural?), but because there is no way you would face judgement on your own merits. Heck, you probably broke several of the 10 commandments already today. How many this year? Be prepared to give an account for every transgression (or, truly repent and truly accept Christ).

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Come to me, all you who are weary and burdened, and I will give you rest. Take my yoke upon you and learn from me, for I am gentle and humble in heart, and you will find rest for your souls. For my yoke is easy and my burden is light. Matt 11:28-29

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Posted: 13 February 2006 01:16 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 11 ]  
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Champ, so:

A strong Christian is one who knows the law, the penalties thereof, and usually the sole motivation for accepting Christ is to escape the wrath that surely cometh.

You are afraid, aren’t you? Pitiful, a life lived in fear, and still recommending it to others.

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Posted: 13 February 2006 03:01 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 12 ]  
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Hi Rod, to answer your question, NO.

Why should I fear anything? I have unlimited mercy and grace because of my decision for Christ. Christ says that nothing and no one can pluck us from his hands. He also said, he will no likewise cast us out. So, I’m as happy as a pig in….....slop.

By the way, we do not want to make people afraid when discussing the law and its penalities. We want them to first know that they broke the law, which leads to sorrowful repentance, then a decision for Christ because of the offer of mercy, grace, and support. Bada bing!....

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Come to me, all you who are weary and burdened, and I will give you rest. Take my yoke upon you and learn from me, for I am gentle and humble in heart, and you will find rest for your souls. For my yoke is easy and my burden is light. Matt 11:28-29

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Posted: 13 February 2006 08:57 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 13 ]  
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kpossible76 - I would suggest, if you want to seriously discuss a topic, don’t respond to the posters TheChampion or treblinka (advice I don’t always follow).  They tend to derail topics, as is evident in these last few posts.

I’m no homunculus or monkeyman - in fact, I think I’m bordering on simpleton - but your situation sounds a bit “Fiddler on the Roof"ish, if I may.  The main character’s daughters nearly all left his faith, and he was greatly troubled.  The gap seemed to exist because the strength within Teveye for his religious tradition was not enough when transferred to his daughters who were existing in a world of such change.  But, how could he accept them if they rejected his god, or, worse yet, marry into a rival faith of a rival community that terrorized his own?  Imagine your father if you were to marry a muslim and convert?  On the other hand, how could he reject his own daughters, his own flesh a blood?

The daughters never stopped loving their father, which made rejecting his daughters much more difficult than accepting them as they were, despite their rejection of his religious tradition.  Don’t close that door for your father.  He may only need time.  It seems to me, he might not be able to join you on this journey, but that doesn’t mean he can’t be there for you.

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Posted: 13 February 2006 09:24 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 14 ]  
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Welcome, KP.

TheChamp only has hobgoblins—they feed on ignorance and crap out fear.

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Posted: 14 February 2006 08:05 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 15 ]  
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thank you to those of you who seem to understand what i’m dealing with.  Yeah, My parents are not upset with me. just upset in general about the situation.  I had a really rough convo with them over Christmas about it.  But things seem to be cool.  i just get frustrated when they talk about the programs and stuff at their church.  I try to be supportive of them.  But at the same time, the more I learn, the harder that gets.

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