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The Dawkins Delusion
Posted: 25 January 2007 01:28 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 166 ]  
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[quote author=“Bad_Conduct”]It’s ok, you guys are welcome to conform and buy into Atheism. It doesn’t bother me one bit. I’ll write a book about how bad religion is just so you buy it and make me rich. Are you that blind?

BC, you can’t even string two coherent sentences together. Do not attempt to write a book.  :D

Nothing is real until I have been there and seen it for myself.

Boy, are you missing out on a lot of stuff going on behind your back.

I’ll take your word for it if I have to

But you don’t, BC. You just don’t. Methinks from your discourse that the fact that you don’t has long since caught up with you and bitten you in the a$$.

It is foolish to assume the Sun will rise tomorrow. You should be prepared for the possibility it will not rise tomorrow. You could go blind.

How do you prepare for that possibility, BC? Why do you think you are doing a better job of preparing than I am?

You believe that, without reason, all things that are will remain the same.

Nobody stated anything remotely resembling this nonsense. I think you believe that there is no order to the Universe (which is not the same as stasis).

You can’t just make assumptions on old information. There is going to be a lot of change in the future. More change than the past can understand.

It will never be the same twice.

Change is not the same as disorder. You see it all as disorder.

I said, I can write a book on how to be an atheist and still be religious just to make a few bucks. It all comes down to money.

And I say you won’t find a publisher for it.

When will you start to seperate REALITY from ADVERTISING?

I have. It’s called science.

If you haven’t seen it, it is not real.

You really believe this, don’t you?

You know all the problems but you have yet to find any valuable solutions.

Please, please, please, just cite one solution to any of those problems that you have ever come up with yourself. Or did you just want to make invidious distinctions?

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Posted: 25 January 2007 03:11 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 167 ]  
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You cannot KNOW God, therefore, you are left with BELIEF.

The universe is self aware. That is God. That is why things work the specific way they do. I look into the night sky and see stars, that is God.

be·lief
noun 1. something believed; an opinion or conviction: a belief that the earth is flat. 
2. confidence in the truth or existence of something not immediately susceptible to rigorous proof: a statement unworthy of belief. 
3. confidence; faith; trust: a child’s belief in his parents. 
4. a religious tenet or tenets; religious creed or faith: the Christian belief. 

A belief is confidence in the truth.

“I don’t believe that plane just flew into those buildings”, they are not making a statement that conforms to the requirements of belief.

They litterally are not confident that a plane flew into those buildings.

You can’t change the meaning of a word (such a belief) just to justify your opinion on how it SHOULD be used.

Please, please, please, just cite one solution to any of those problems that you have ever come up with yourself. Or did you just want to make invidious distinctions?

Genocide. Oh, you ment a solution that everyone agrees with.

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Posted: 25 January 2007 03:54 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 168 ]  
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The universe is self aware. That is God. That is why things work the specific way they do. I look into the night sky and see stars, that is God.

BC, where you see an aware universe, I see a mathematically consistant universe. You’re universe boarders on some sort of strange sentience in which all wrongs are righted, in which everything “works”. BC, bad things DO happen to good people… all the time. Bad people get away with murder approximately 60% of the time (watching too much CSI might be clouding your judgement of the reality of the situation). If the universe is sentient (God), the universe is petty, crewl, and much like a child that bought an ant farm but forgot they had it after a while.

A belief is confidence in the truth.

Yes it is. This does not make it truth. This is why BELIEF and KNOWLEDGE are two wholly separate things. Conviction is NOT truth, not immediately susceptible to rigorous proof… I wonder what this could be - wait a minute… that’s BELIEF.

They litterally are not confident that a plane flew into those buildings.

I may be willing to concede something on ths particular point. However, we’re talking about an event that could be re-interperated far too many ways. i.e. some people may not have witnessed the planes actually hitting the building. They may have initially thought that a missile, meteor, internal gas explosion was somehow responsible. But it doesn’t change the fact that a plane plowed into the building. How can there be a genuine belief in anything (or a lack of belief in anything) when there is objective, empirical evidence about anything (i.e. they saw the plane, the heard the explosion, other people reacted to the event, debris fell from buildings)? Does this mean that all beliefs are unjustified? No. But it does mean that all beliefs are either justified and untrue, unjustified and true, or unjustified and untrue. Belief is most decidedly NOT justified and true… that is KNOWLEDGE. I would still maintain that an expression such as “I don’t believe” in something when empirical, objective evidence is wrong because there cannot be a lack of belief in this instance because belief in this case is verified truth… KNOWLEDGE. They have KNOWLEDGE, but they choose to ignore it. This is irrational. They may be justified in their irrationality (shock, non-rational reactive emotion…) but it does not make it true.

I’ve said enough on this little carousel of logic and reasoning and I’m sure that most people reading this are going “why do you bother, the monkeys are going to get it before BC does”... just wanted to take one last kick at the can. Can’s been kicked. I’m done.

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Posted: 25 January 2007 03:56 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 169 ]  
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[quote author=“Bad_Conduct”]

Please, please, please, just cite one solution to any of those problems that you have ever come up with yourself. Or did you just want to make invidious distinctions?

Genocide. Oh, you ment a solution that everyone agrees with.

Wait, go back for a second. What was the problem that this solves? I don’t care if everyone agrees with it, I just want you to name the problem and tell me how genocide solves it.

But I doubt you will be able to do so sensibly, since you appear to have the focused attention span of a chicken with its head cut off.

Also, you didn’t invent the idea of genocide. But then again, you don’t have much of anything in the way of original thinking in the universe of problem solving.

The universe is self aware. That is God. That is why things work the specific way they do.

And what specific way is that? Be specific.

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Posted: 25 January 2007 04:10 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 170 ]  
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[quote author=“Bad_Conduct”]The universe is self aware. That is God. That is why things work the specific way they do. I look into the night sky and see stars, that is God.

You present a sever form of cognitive dissonance. You have in your had 2 opposing ideeas that you held to be true.

You say you believe in the Bible and thus you believe that Jehova is “the God”. You also claim that God is the “self-aware universe”. Something that is self-aware cannot be unaware of something that it contains. Yet Jehova had moments when he wasn’t aware of the suffering of his own people. So Jehova cannot be God. And yet you have claimed that Jehova is God.

It’s time to make a choice Bad_Conduct: take the red pill and believe in the self-aware-universe-god or take the blue pill and believe the jehova-writer-of-the-bible-god. Do you believe in God or the Bible? Although you can choose to live with your cognitive dissonance and remove all doubt that you are an idiot and not just a fool deceived by its environment.

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Posted: 25 January 2007 04:27 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 171 ]  
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[quote author=“Bad_Conduct”]You can’t change the meaning of a word (such a belief) just to justify your opinion on how it SHOULD be used.

No, you can’t. But you in fact attempt this in every post you make.

I was previously unaware that inmates in assisted living facilities for the mentally- and/or emotionally-challenged were allowed as much access to the Internet as you seem to have.

You appear to have the emotional and intellectual development of a twelve-year old. If you are between the ages of 30 and 65, you are in serious trouble, because I can’t see how you keep it together even to feed and clothe yourself, let alone find the amount of leisure time that you use to torment us here. I hope you have reserved a large quantity of very prosperous adults caring for you, because time is running out for you in the real world.

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Posted: 25 January 2007 04:59 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 172 ]  
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[quote author=“Bad_Conduct”]
noun 1. something believed; an opinion or conviction: a belief that the earth is flat. 
2. confidence in the truth or existence of something not immediately susceptible to rigorous proof: a statement unworthy of belief. 
3. confidence; faith; trust: a child’s belief in his parents. 
4. a religious tenet or tenets; religious creed or faith: the Christian belief.  [/color]

A belief is confidence in the truth.

Actually, BC, confidence in one thing or another has its own definition. Belief, on the other hand, reveals lack of confidence in something. “I believe it’s starting to rain.” Does the preceding sentence reveal confidence in something to you? Incipient rain can feel as though it may or may not be raining. A thorough drenching, on the other hand, would never have someone making such a comment (“I believe it’s raining”) unless that person were joking. I guess you had to be there.

Knowledge is confidence in truth. Belief is something very different. It seems apparent to me that the word belief has struggled against so much cognitive dissonance over the centuries that it has become twisted up and/or shrivelled in its usefulness to speakers and writers who attempt to convey their thoughts and messages efficiently. Have fun with it, though, in your befuddled Christian apologetics, all which tend to thrive on twisting up what is otherwise simple.

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Philosophy may in no way interfere with the actual use of language; it can in the end only describe it. For it cannot give it any foundations either. It leaves everything as it is.
Ludwig Wittgenstein

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Posted: 25 January 2007 05:28 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 173 ]  
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[quote author=“Bad_Conduct”]Even when I successfully prove a point with visual evidence, you just disagree and spill slander.

I don’t know what point you think you have proved BC, but it certainly not the one we’ve been questioning. What evidence do you have that the universe is self aware, much less God, other than your own opinion?

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Posted: 25 January 2007 06:54 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 174 ]  
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Actually, BC, confidence in one thing or another has its own definition. Belief, on the other hand, reveals lack of confidence in something.

No, you can’t. But you in fact attempt this in every post you make.

Call the dictionary and argue with them.

You appear to have the emotional and intellectual development of a twelve-year old.

...go back to trying to lower my level when you give up raising your own. When you have nothing good to say, just make everything else look bad. Oh yah, I was ignoring you for a reason. You’re a hypocrate.

BC, where you see an aware universe, I see a mathematically consistant universe.

The Universe is not consistant. Consider this: The universe is of infinite size, it has no end.

At some point between >0 and infinity, the Universe must reach the point of self awareness.

I am a part of the Universe, and I am aware of its existence. The Universe, or some small part of it, always “knows” that it exists.

The collective of all life on Earth is part of the Universal awareness. If a soldier dies in Iraq, everyone in America is effected. Maybe not greatly, but a little piece inside from friends or family. Some more than others. You can’t live in a bubble, ignoring the world around you and not taking responsibility for your actions.

If a Star explodes across the Galaxy, Earth will eventually feel the effects, even if they are minor.

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Posted: 25 January 2007 09:48 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 175 ]  
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[quote author=“Bad_Conduct”]

Actually, BC, confidence in one thing or another has its own definition. Belief, on the other hand, reveals lack of confidence in something.

. . .
Call the dictionary and argue with them.

BC, do you have the phone number handy? (Just kidding.) The dictionary I tend to rely on for no reason other than that it always sits within reach when I’m writing, says “. . . belief, the term of broadest application in this comparison, implies mental acceptance of something as true, even though absolute certainty may be absent; . . .”

Modern dictionaries (descriptive) only sample relatively current usages of a word. They don’t for the most part attempt to prescribe a definition. My goal with seeking a definition of words that are important sometimes goes somewhat beyond descriptive and prescriptive attempts. It’s more like an ontological definition—ferreting out ignored or avoided nuances. Certain commonly used words benefit from such an approach, but “belief” is one that does just fine with ordinary descriptive dictionaries, as long as the dictionary chosen is reasonably comprehensive.

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Philosophy may in no way interfere with the actual use of language; it can in the end only describe it. For it cannot give it any foundations either. It leaves everything as it is.
Ludwig Wittgenstein

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Posted: 25 January 2007 01:07 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 176 ]  
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Click here for Dictionary.com feedback form.

You can tell them what you BELIEVE the meaning of BELIEF should be.  rolleyes

I will note your inconsistancies.

You say you believe in the Bible and thus you believe that Jehova is “the God”. (Who is Jehova? I am talking about GOD) You also claim that God is the “self-aware universe”. Something that is self-aware cannot be unaware of something that it contains. Yet Jehova had moments when he wasn’t aware of the suffering of his own people. (God is always aware of suffering. Human suffering may not be suffering to God) So Jehova cannot be God(God is God). And yet you have claimed that Jehova is God. (When?)

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Posted: 25 January 2007 01:11 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 177 ]  
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[quote author=“Bad_Conduct”]I am a part of the Universe, and I am aware of its existence.

So what makes you believe that it is aware of you? Why would your universal awareness worry about how we live our lives?

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Posted: 25 January 2007 02:17 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 178 ]  
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So what makes you believe that it is aware of you? Why would your universal awareness worry about how we live our lives?

Because you are aware of me, and you are equally a part of it. I need to worry about what it will take to keep you alive because you are human. You deserve to be alive. Other people will try to take your life from you, your money, your wife, your house, for their own personal gain.

Because no matter what I do, or where I do it, someone will either be positively or negativly affected, including myself.

Because millions of people die and suffer each day from countless preventable reasons. The Government we vote for lies and steals from us, and we accept it as normal. There are so many cover-ups covering up the cover-ups, conspiracies to cover conspiracies, lies to cover up lies.

Because people hide and commit crimes under Internet nick-names and assume no responsibility. They believe they are Gods of the Matrix. They pirate software, movies, games, music, books… everything that can be digital. The more they steal, the more the costs go up. When will they all come forward, confess their crimes and take blame for their mistakes? When will they fight for their rights in court rather than living anoymous lives in fear of the real world and real consequences?

Because people seem to act before they think, invade countries, rape, murder, abuse, steal, pillage, burn, torture, lie, cheat, steal… each word has a meaning, each word was an act before it was a definition. The laws weren’t written before they were broken. I read the news today, oh boy. I can’t even tell fact from fiction anymore. Did someone die in Iraq or are they just trying to sell me one of the products in this picture?

Because when you hurt someone, directly or indirectly, you only justify reasoning to be hurt yourself.

The sooner the world can unite, the far less violent and destructive our future will be. Think about how much is taken away for us to live the way we do, when they try to legatimatly take it back through law and business, we bomb their countries and murder their children. The Canadian government supported Isreal’s invasion of Lebanon, but now leads the funding for their reconstruction. What a joke, we should have prevented the destruction in the first place. We are paying for a war we encouraged. And it has nothing to do with me.

The worse the world around you becomes, the more you focus on internet, television, video games and novels. You bury your noise and avoid the unavoidable. You debate the very essence of existence and can barily justify your purpose and meaning in life. You are missing out on the real universe and all it has to value. History isn’t a documentary, God is not a book and polluting our environment is greatly affecting how you live.

When will you realize?

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Posted: 26 January 2007 02:47 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 179 ]  
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[quote author=“Bad_Conduct”]Because you are aware of me, and you are equally a part of it.

Following this line of reasoning, how can there be any “self”? If we are all equally part of the universal awareness, then is there really any “me” to be aware of “you”?

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Posted: 26 January 2007 04:13 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 180 ]  
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Following this line of reasoning, how can there be any “self”? If we are all equally part of the universal awareness, then is there really any “me” to be aware of “you”?

There is more awareness in the universe outside of me and you.

Humans are equal, but animals are not.

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