NUMBERS

 
 
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Dee
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27 June 2009 23:28
 
unsmoked - 21 June 2009 06:18 PM
eudemonia - 21 June 2009 10:59 AM

‘Religion is the one area of our discourse where it is considered noble to pretend to be certain about things no human being could possibly be certain about.’

Tremendous quote by Sam.

Much like the saying that when one person is deluded he/she is considered to be insane, but when many people are deluded they are considered to be religious, and thats acceptable. Why? Because of the NUMBERS?

We know that if anyone in the world believed that an elephant could fly they would be considered insane.  We know that millions of Muslims believe that a horse can fly, and that they are not considered insane.  Why not insane?  Because of the numbers.

We know that if anyone believed that Elvis could come out of his grave alive they would be considered insane.  We know that millions of people believe that Jesus came out of his grave alive and that they are not considered insane.  Why?  Because of the numbers.

Mormons believe all kinds of insane things.  Shucks, we came close to electing one president.  Sarah Palin could be president at this very moment, considering John’s age.  What was it?  45 percent voted in that direction?  Their campaign slogan?  It might as well be, “Vote for me.  I’m insane like you.”  Numbers.

 

Good point smokie…numbers win , and that’s a frightening thought !  Yes, we came fairly close to electing a Mormon president, but fortunate for us the numbers of those who think Mormonism is TABOO were greater than the Mitt believers.  Yes Muslims believe that horses ( as thier faith teaches ) can fly; they also believe that thier flag, the green flag of Islam ,will one day fly perched atop of the White House USA. This is common understanding amongst them. And , speaking of numbers, they are the fastest growing people on earth and thier religion is the fastest growing religion on Earth.  No kidding….be afraid ; very afraid.

 
 
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unsmoked
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28 June 2009 16:28
 
Dee - 28 June 2009 03:28 AM

[
Yes Muslims believe that horses ( as thier faith teaches ) can fly; they also believe that thier flag, the green flag of Islam ,will one day fly perched atop of the White House USA. This is common understanding amongst them. And , speaking of numbers, they are the fastest growing people on earth and thier religion is the fastest growing religion on Earth.  No kidding….be afraid ; very afraid.

Most Christians are very insistent that there shouldn’t be laws to control the human population explosion.  They are also very insistent that all parents must be allowed to indoctrinate their children with religious bigotry.  Little do they know where the ‘religious demographics’ are pointing.

On the back cover of the April 20, 2009 issue of the New Yorker magazine, MONSANTO has a full-page ad.  The photo shows a blurred snapshot of shoulder to shoulder people rushing in all directions, like a New York or Tokyo subway station during rush-hour.  The headline says:  “9 billion people to feed.  A changing climate.  NOW WHAT?”

The fine print goes on to say that we’ll need to double agricultural output by 2050 ‘to feed a growing world.  Of course, we are told, ‘Biotechnology can help’.  MONSANTO to the rescue!

Excuse me, but aren’t we already at the tipping point?  (tipping into disaster, that is).  How come Mr. Monsanto doesn’t mention population control?  At what point of human misery are the Christians going to say, “Hey!  There’s too many of us!  What’s so evil and difficult about scaling down to 2 kids per family?  Numbers.

 
 
 
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unsmoked
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05 July 2009 14:22
 

NUMBERS

On several occasions in his books, Sam Harris has expressed interest in God’s beetle creation - 250,000 separate species.  It’s likely that if you pushed into a remote valley in the Pegunungin Mountains you could add to this remarkable collection of Coleoptera.

I’ve heard that there is a Creationist Museum somewhere.  I wonder if it has occured to the curator there to put this collection on display?  The exhibit could also include fossils of all the extinct beetles, perhaps swelling the exhibit to 500,000 separate species.  I can’t find the page, but I think Sam was wondering about God’s inordinate fondness for beetles.  A beetle fetish?

Now, if there were 250,000 species of primates, perhaps creationists could single out one or two as being very closely related to us.  By that I mean, close enough to attend church, but not close enough to sing properly.  Vox interruptus or something, causing hiccups on the hallelujahs.

 
 
tavishhill2003
 
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tavishhill2003
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28 July 2009 11:39
 
chris madden - 12 June 2009 04:21 AM

3.  If you fold a newspaper 100 times it will be thicker than the known universe.  (use calculator to double the thickness when it becomes too thick to fold).  (cited by Sam Harris in ‘The End of Faith.’

As a child I was told that no matter how big a piece of paper was you could never fold it more than eight times. I’ve never questioned this assertion, as it seemed too incredible not to be true.
Have I been living under a delusion all of my life?

It’s false. I’ve done it.  But you won’t be going much more than 8.

 
 
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unsmoked
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28 July 2009 12:55
 
tavishhill2003 - 28 July 2009 03:39 PM
chris madden - 12 June 2009 04:21 AM

3.  If you fold a newspaper 100 times it will be thicker than the known universe.  (use calculator to double the thickness when it becomes too thick to fold).  (cited by Sam Harris in ‘The End of Faith.’

As a child I was told that no matter how big a piece of paper was you could never fold it more than eight times. I’ve never questioned this assertion, as it seemed too incredible not to be true.
Have I been living under a delusion all of my life?

It’s false. I’ve done it.  But you won’t be going much more than 8.

The point is to double the thickness of newsprint 100 times, not to get hung up on the word ‘fold’.  Geez.

[ Edited: 28 July 2009 12:59 by unsmoked]
 
 
tavishhill2003
 
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tavishhill2003
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18 August 2009 00:32
 

Ok, but you asked specifically about folding it 8 times or more.  And just to be more specific, you are doubling the thickness of the previously folded paper, not the individual thickness of the printed pages.  raspberry

 
 
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unsmoked
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18 August 2009 12:35
 
tavishhill2003 - 18 August 2009 04:32 AM

Ok, but you asked specifically about folding it 8 times or more.  And just to be more specific, you are doubling the thickness of the previously folded paper, not the individual thickness of the printed pages.  raspberry

I need to find the paragraph in ‘THE END OF FAITH’ where Sam Harris mentioned this - fold a newspaper one hundred times and it will be thicker than the known universe.  Maybe he said it in such a way that it was easily understood.

A similar story is about the caliph who was so pleased with the mathematician who ‘invented’ the game of chess that he asked him to name a wish.  The mathematician said, “On the chess board, give me a grain of rice on the first square, two grains on the second, four on the third - doubling the grains on each square of the board.”  The caliph was delighted with such an easy thing to supply, but before getting to the last square he needed more rice than ten kingdoms could supply.

 
 
 
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Cro-Magnum
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18 August 2009 16:34
 

An immunology professor of mine said that if a bacterium that had unlimited nutrients etc. and the right conditions would continue to divide and be a mass the size of the moon in two days.

 
 
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GAD
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18 August 2009 18:05
 
 
 
 
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eudemonia
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19 August 2009 05:59
 

Astounding facts and figures about bacterium are practically endless. From Stephen Goulds book
‘Full House’

1 spoon full of high quality soil contains approximately 10 TRILLION bacteria.

Fully 10 percent of our own dry weight consists of bacteria, some of which, although they are not a congenital part of our bodies, we could not live without.

Bacteria have been found thriving around deep ocean vents where the water permeating from the earths interior is 480 degrees farenheit.

Damn, god has a vivid imagination doesn’t he? Either that or he is quite fond of NUMBERS, or perhaps statistics.

 
 
 
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unsmoked
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19 August 2009 15:19
 
Cro-Magnum - 18 August 2009 08:34 PM

An immunology professor of mine said that if a bacterium that had unlimited nutrients etc. and the right conditions would continue to divide and be a mass the size of the moon in two days.

I heard that if all fertilized oyster eggs produced in one year survived to adulthood, the earth would have a layer of oysters 5 miles thick.  Three cheers for the food chain.  By the way, baby oysters are free swimming and get to enjoy themselves before attaching themselves to a rock and being stuck for the rest of their lives.  Sound familiar?

 
 
bigredfutbol
 
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bigredfutbol
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20 August 2009 09:47
 
eudemonia - 19 August 2009 09:59 AM

Bacteria have been found thriving around deep ocean vents where the water permeating from the earths interior is 480 degrees farenheit.

Damn, god has a vivid imagination doesn’t he? Either that or he is quite fond of NUMBERS, or perhaps statistics.

What’s funny is that the Old Testament makes it clear that God gave us dominion over ALL the animals of the earth; yet there were thousands upon thousands of creatures living in places like the deep sea vents we didn’t know about for thousands of years, and still can’t for all practical purpose “dominate”.  And what about microbes?  Or viruses?  Why don’t we have “dominion” over them?

 
 
sam harris is a neocon idiot
 
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sam harris is a neocon idiot
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20 August 2009 12:28
 
unsmoked - 19 August 2009 07:19 PM
Cro-Magnum - 18 August 2009 08:34 PM

An immunology professor of mine said that if a bacterium that had unlimited nutrients etc. and the right conditions would continue to divide and be a mass the size of the moon in two days.

I heard that if all fertilized oyster eggs produced in one year survived to adulthood, the earth would have a layer of oysters 5 miles thick.  Three cheers for the food chain.  By the way, baby oysters are free swimming and get to enjoy themselves before attaching themselves to a rock and being stuck for the rest of their lives.  Sound familiar?

Except for the part about the pearl.

And let’s not forget, god hates shellfish.

 
 
goodgraydrab
 
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goodgraydrab
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20 August 2009 13:48
 

Thought you might be interested in this from Intelligent Design Theory. From the book, Darwinism Under the Microscope, How Recent Scientific Evidence Points to Devine Design, by James P. Gills, M.D. & Tom Woodard, Ph.D. Here’s a section:

The solution of the popular Rubik’s Cube offers a colorful illustration of the impossibility of our accidental genesis by approximating the odds of the random evolution of a single protein of the human body. If a human subject were handed a cube and blindfolded, to ensure that all moves were random, this subject would need 1,350 billion years, at a rate of one move per second, to solve the cube. That span is 300 times the accepted age of the earth that dedicated evolutionists allow in their 15-billion-year-old universe. The odds against each move producing a color match on the cube are 5(10,000,000,000,000,000,000th power) to 1. Such odds are unfathomable given that we use more than 20,000 different proteins in our cells.

Our enzymes serve to refute Darwin as well. There are some 2,000 of these catalysts in our body, and the chance of finding all 2,000 by accident “is about the same as the chance of throwing an uninterrupted sequence of 50,000 sixes with an unbiased dice!” There are an estimated 10(80th power) atoms in the universe, and our odds for random emergence of all enzymes are 1 in 10(40,000th power). This means that life could not have appeared by “earthbound random forces even if the whole universe consisted of primeval soup.”

There’s more, but they conclude that:

The odds of life having been assembled by a Designer are indeed greater.

Of course, this is predicated on their model of irreducible complexity; and how they figure the odds of a designer are greater ... they don’t say.

[ Edited: 20 August 2009 13:50 by goodgraydrab]
 
 
 
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unsmoked
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20 August 2009 13:51
 
bigredfutbol - 20 August 2009 01:47 PM

  And what about microbes?  Or viruses?  Why don’t we have “dominion” over them?

Just be thankful you don’t live downwind from a commercial apple orchard.  Planes are always ‘strafing’ the trees with deadly chemicals.  Gott strafe bugs!  (God punish bugs!) Some Chinese orchardmen are now having to hire people to fertilize each blossom by hand in order to get a crop.  Ummm, where have all the bees gone?